Buying new router

[SmallNetGuy]

My old Asus RT-AC68U is slowly dying. It's the 800 MHz CPU version, H/W: A2

With MerlinWRT, this router served me well, although I've had some problems lately with WiFi sporadically disconnecting from my smartphones and the laptop at the main floor (two floors below the room with my router). I know it's pretty far from the router, but I really never had any trouble in the past. I believe this grandpa is at its last breath here

Anyway, after few years it is time to buy a new one, so I was thinking about some other good options out there. There is a lot of mixed reviews on almost all router models, and as always noobs like myself, easily get confused. I love Synology RT2600AC, and its user interface/OS, and it would be clearly my choice this time around... but unfortunately, little too expensive for me at this point, so I can only keep drooling

I was looking at some TP-Link models (AC2600, AC3150 v2, and AC3200). I was also looking at some Linksys models (Linksys EA8500, at $229 CAD currently, 23% discounted). Currently my local store has TP-Link AC3200 on sale ($180 CAD), $60 less than usual price. Is it worth it? What would you more experienced people around here recommend? My budget currently is around $200 CAD, so that's another limiting factor I guess

I am not interested in MU-MIMO since all that sounds like something good in theory, and in practice maybe it will never actually take off... but I want something that's little more advanced and future proof than my old ASUS RT-AC68U. Possibly more range. I am not so worried about the speed, as I am worried about the distance I can reach the signal with WiFi devices in my home.

Thank you so much in advance.

EDIT: forgot to add, I am currently using my super old Apple Airport Extreme Base Station, A1354, updated to the latest firmware, and I have better coverage and stronger signal than what I ever had with my ASUS RT-AC68U. Not sure why is that, but it is...

 

[System Error Message]

synology's router makes sense if you use other synology products. They arent exactly the best value with routers but the fact that it uses the qualcomm 4x4 is a good reason to consider.
the AC2600 is better than the AC3100, they usually come with better CPUs (qualcomm kraits vs broadcom A9), and the numbers mean nothing (does anyone really uses broadcom xstream on 2.4Ghz? I expect such performance gains to be impossible in today's busy 2.4Ghz environments).

MU-MIMO does work in practice, hence why i suggested qualcomm over broadcom for this, otherwise for usual 3x3 platform both are good.

5Ghz will never get good reception, this is just the nature of it. It has less penetration than 2.4Ghz but has more speed as the upside. So if you want range, stick with a router that has good 2.4Ghz. Essentially new routers have better range due to better wifi chips and rf design (something that was discussed here before).

The AC3200 is a triband, it has 2x5Ghz radios. Since you need range and not speed, it is useless. The problem you have with your current AC68U is that you likely either ran it too hot for long (wifi chips should be kept at 50C or lower, never exceeding 60C) or power supply could be failing or you juiced your tx power for too long. For your information i run my AC88U tx power differently. I max out 5Ghz and set 2.4Ghz to minimum. Coverage is way better than i need and passes through a lot of brick walls. Its very easy to fry your wifi chips as they are sensitive.

Dont forget the CPU too, it needs to be fast enough for your WAN speed and any features you run (like ip firewall, QoS and such if you do use them).
AC3200 and 5300 are triband routers, useless for your needs. So stick with what you need, 2x2, 3x3 and 4x4 wifi AC. Qualcomm's solution tends to stack better because they came late to the game so they implemented wave 2 from start. Im sure @sfx2000 can tell you more. I would strongly suggest looking at snb's charts as it paints a good picture too. look at 2.4Ghz as this is what you'll need for range. You should also remember that range is also dependent on client, if the AP's signal is very strong clients can see it further away, but they may not necessarily be able to connect back for being to weak to transmit. sfx would say that having more APs are better and i agree with him especially if you value your battery life.

You also posted in the wrong section. This is for wired only routers (like mikrotik, pfsense) and not wifi routers, did you read the small print below the name?

 

[SmallNetGuy]

Hi,

First of all, thank you so much for your reply, greatly appreciated! So that's why I see my 5GHz and even though it looks like I have full signal on my main floor and the basement, it's probably slower than dialup, at least 10 times

2.4GHz still works but as I mentioned earlier, sporadically... Sometimes it works OK, sometimes not.

I've checked temperatures, that was the first thing, and it's always around 56-58 Celsius degrees. I do have one of those USB fans plugged into the back of my PC, and pointing into the back of the router, so it should always be fairly cool.

I will look into some options, it can really be overwhelming at times. I just don't want to buy something only because two of my friends are swearing "it works the best"... Every situation is different, every setup is different, thickness and type of walls, distance from the router etc. So if something works for them, it does not have to neccessarily work for me... Besides, I've never liked D-Link anyway. Only had problems in the past.

Thank you again, at least now I know I shouldn't be looking at the unit with strong 5GHz side, I should be looking at really good performer in 2.4 GHz field.

I am so sorry for posting in wrong forum section. My eyes are not serving me as good as before, and this smart phone (Moto G3) has really small screen. I can't see any details when reading/posting.

Please mods, feel free to move this post to the more apropriate part of the forum, or erase it all together if needed. I am so sorry once again

Kind regards

 

[System Error Message]

dont worry im sure a mod will move this thread (there are too few mods imo).
Most of us here wouldnt consider dlink. 50+C is ok on wifi, just dont let it go above 60C. taping a USB fan onto your router may cool it better. I did so on mine which was a huge difference, even a cheap usb laptop cooler for a few $ did wonders and let me overclock my AC68U to 1.4Ghz while maintaining good temps. If this fixes your problem you may not even need a new wifi router.

Try tweaking the settings, tweak 5Ghz for speed and busy networks, tweak 2.4Ghz for range and busy networks. Its not only the tx settings but there are many settings in the advanced section that you can tweak for better results. If wifi is still sporadic (as in no signal even when near) than it could be time to replace it. There is a comprehensive guide somewhere on what each setting means.

Many brands have a focus on what the excell in. tp link provides value by using basic firmware and hardware that isnt top of the line, that means it usually has a slower CPU compared to the same from asus or netgear, so while it may have rock solid firmware it does so by having few features, only things the basic home user would use. Netgear has good hardware but firmware isnt great, though a lot of their hardware supports 3rd party firmware. Asus has rmerlin firmware and some of their routers are compatible with 3rd party and usually tends to market their routers towards gaming which tends to make them cost a lot more than they should. Netgear routers tend to cost more than asus even without the gaming name but the hike the many sellers put on asus tends to change it.

 

[SmallNetGuy]

OK, thank you so much once again! I will try to learn about all the settings in advanced settings section, and see if I can come up with something that would help.

Just to add, all our devices (iPad mini, G3 and laptop) connect and keep strong wifi when we are on the same floor where the router is... Even the one below... But the problems start to pile up when we're two floors below at the main floor, or even worse three floors below when in basement. It's a townhouse unit, pretty narrow, but tall. Sure, one would ask why do we even need connection in basement... It's because my wife has a small studio and do all her work there. Also she heavily depends on the internet connection since it's an online shop (Etsy style). These are pretty old units, back then no one even knew what RJ45 connector is, so of course there is no way to have wired connection there. It might be a good idea to invest some money and have someone fish some cables through walls That is if we're not planning to move in next couple of months. Oh well...

Thank you so much for your kindness and willingness to help total stranger... A stupid one while we're at that But at least I am trying to learn.

Kind regards

 

[MichaelCG]

If you can't get hard-wire access, do you have access to COAX lines across the floors? Or even consider using PowerLine and running a 2nd AP in the basement. A single AP serving through multiple floors and/or walls just isn't usually a great experience.

 

[SmallNetGuy]

If you can't get hard-wire access, do you have access to COAX lines across the floors? Or even consider using PowerLine and running a 2nd AP in the basement. A single AP serving through multiple floors and/or walls just isn't usually a great experience.

Hi Michael,

Thank you for your input, greatly appreciated.

Unfortunately, no any kind of lines inside the floors. The only one cable that's going throughout the whole building, is the TV cable, nothing else. Power lines of course.

Yes, it came to my mind to use some signal extender or something, so my initial idea was to run ASUS RT-AC68U on the top floor where my studio is, and maybe put Airport Extreme Base Station in the basement (or better, on main floor) or something as an repeater or something. Unfortunately, Apple forums killed that idea in the beginning, since Airport won't do that with other routers, and it has to be connected with network cable... which of course defeats the purpose of having wireless... If I had that cable running through my walls, I'd simply connect my wife's laptop with RJ45 directly plugged into my ASUS router then. It sounds so complicated, and I have no idea how to achieve that. I thought that would work, since I already have that Airport Extreme laying around... but nope, no luck

I've also read in these forums that if I use range extenders that would cut my signal in half on the top floors. Would that affect my daughter gaming experience (online multi-players, Roblox, Minecraft etc.) if she is using wired connection (RJ45) to my router, or that would affect only wifi experince upstairs?

Canada Computers is selling some pretty decent stuff for cheap:
http://www.canadacomputers.com/index.php?cPath=27_1056_1058

Would any of these work fine with my ASUS RT-AC68U if there is no any possibility to use Airport Extreme as my range extender? Maybe this one:
http://www.canadacomputers.com/product_info.php?cPath=27_1056_1058&item_id=079595

Thank you once again!

 

[System Error Message]

the tv cable is coax

 

[SmallNetGuy]

the tv cable is coax

Sure, it has that mesh protection around the cable, but how would I use that in order to be able to use wired connection. It has to be RJ45 on both ends, correct? TV cable has only one line in the middle, and if I am not mistaken RJ45 has 8 connections.

 

[degrub]

Look up MOCA 2 in the LAN section of the forum. The modems are used to bridge ethernet packets across the cable without interfering with the analog or digital cable operation. Actiontec has MOCA modems available to retail users. i have 5 in my house for a backbone ethernet across RG-6 cable. The modem has an ethernet connection same as your router or switch.

 

[SmallNetGuy]

Look up MOCA 2 in the LAN section of the forum. The modems are used to bridge ethernet packets across the cable without interfering with the analog or digital cable operation. Actiontec has MOCA modems available to retail users. i have 5 in my house for a backbone ethernet across RG-6 cable. The modem has an ethernet connection same as your router or switch.

Thanks. If I am not mistaken, that would be a lot more expensive option than going with some range extenders that I could plug into the power line wall plugs? I understand MOCA 2 would give a lot better signal (just by quick Googling about it), but those adapters seem pretty pricey around here: https://www.amazon.ca/dp/B013J7O3X0/?tag=smallncom-20

EDIT: Too bad, because this looks like it would be perfect solution. Best of all, we're not even using cable TV, we don't have any subscription with any company, and use regular antenna. We get much more channels in HD than with any providers around here... Plus it's free

TV cables in my house are there, but currently there is no signal going through them. Would that be a problem?

 

[degrub]

it depends on what bandwidth you need. i use a single ethernet over powerline pair to reach one spot in my house and get 50-70 mbit which is adequate for streaming an HD movie (and more reliable than wireless for me.). Adding a third adapter in the house cut the bandwidth so that it was not usable. With powerline, there can be all sorts of issues with arc fault breakers as well as wiring connections. If you go that route, be sure you can return them no penalty.

If you have RG59 cable, you may be limited on speed with MOCA to 1.1 levels. If you have RG-6, close to gigabit is possible. If it is old cable, there can be issues with connectors and sometimes the cable. Any splitters have to to be MOCA2/1.1 compatible and allow bidirectional transmission.

 

[SmallNetGuy]

it depends on what bandwidth you need. i use a single ethernet over powerline pair to reach one spot in my house and get 50-70 mbit which is adequate for streaming an HD movie (and more reliable than wireless for me.). Adding a third adapter in the house cut the bandwidth so that it was not usable. With powerline, there can be all sorts of issues with arc fault breakers as well as wiring connections. If you go that route, be sure you can return them no penalty.

If you have RG59 cable, you may be limited on speed with MOCA to 1.1 levels. If you have RG-6, close to gigabit is possible. If it is old cable, there can be issues with connectors and sometimes the cable. Any splitters have to to be MOCA2/1.1 compatible and allow bidirectional transmission.

I think they all (throughout the whole house) are RG-6 just by looking at the conductor (AWG) diameter. And these cables are pretty sturdy, kind of hard to bend... It's way thicker than one 12 foot cable I purchased at BestBuy. That one has such a thin conductor and it's marked as RG-59.

I actually have one cable that goes all the way from the basement (exactly where I want to connect my wife's laptop), to the top floor in our bed room which is only a few feet away from my small studio with all the equipment (modem, router, computer etc).

Now, if I only can find these MOCA 2 adapters as a part of some good deal around here That would be perfect!

Cheers!

 

[degrub]

Online is generally the cheapest price i have found.
Having a dedicated run will give you maximum bandwidth so unless there is an issue with the cable or the connector termination, it should be close to Gbit.
If you need wireless coverage in the basement just place an access point of whatever flavor needed on a 5 port Gbit unmanaged switch connected to the modem ethernet port. It may be able to cover the ground floor as well.

 

[SmallNetGuy]

Online is generally the cheapest price i have found.
Having a dedicated run will give you maximum bandwidth so unless there is an issue with the cable or the connector termination, it should be close to Gbit.
If you need wireless coverage in the basement just place an access point of whatever flavor needed on a 5 port Gbit unmanaged switch connected to the modem ethernet port. It may be able to cover the ground floor as well.

OK, thank you. To tell you the truth, at this point my wife would be happy even with slightly faster connection than dial-up All she needs is to check her orders, not much browsing other than that. No streaming, nothing major like that. At this point, she types something into Google page, and sometimes it takes up to a minute to get any results. Do you think one of these could work with my ASUS RT-AC68U?

http://www.canadacomputers.com/product_info.php?cPath=27_1056_1058&item_id=079595

Just something to give her decent speed, she really doesn't need anything super fast. Would that rage extender screw up our connection upstairs a lot? I'm guessing only wifi upstairs would be somewhat affected, not wired connections, correct?

Thank you so much for all your help, greatly appreciated!

 

[degrub]

wrong direction. That is wireless to wireless repeater. Cuts the bandwidth in half plus overhead. Waste of money. Use either a ethernet over power (powerline) or ethernet over coax backhaul (MOCA). Even MOCA 1.1 would be better. And more reliable.

Walking upstairs would be the cheapest solution.

 

[SmallNetGuy]

wrong direction. That is wireless to wireless repeater. Cuts the bandwidth in half plus overhead. Waste of money. Use either a ethernet over power (powerline) or ethernet over coax backhaul (MOCA). Even MOCA 1.1 would be better. And more reliable.

Walking upstairs would be the cheapest solution.

OK thanks! Yes, walking upstairs is the cheapest one, but unfortunately her sewing machines are all in the basement and she needs internet to see the orders and customization requests, so going up and down once wouldn't be difficult, but sometimes orders keep pilling up. It would get really tiring after a while.

For now, since we don't need anything special and super fast, I'm thinking Ethernet over power lines should do the trick. I found this one, pretty good price too:
http://www.canadacomputers.com/product_info.php?cPath=27_1054_360&item_id=092075

Thank you once again, you guys are always amazing! And... sorry for my ignorance, you obviously have a lot of patience with people like myself. Thank you for that too!

 

[System Error Message]

OK thanks! Yes, walking upstairs is the cheapest one, but unfortunately her sewing machines are all in the basement and she needs internet to see the orders and customization requests, so going up and down once wouldn't be difficult, but sometimes orders keep pilling up. It would get really tiring after a while.

For now, since we don't need anything special and super fast, I'm thinking Ethernet over power lines should do the trick. I found this one, pretty good price too:
http://www.canadacomputers.com/product_info.php?cPath=27_1054_360&item_id=092075

Thank you once again, you guys are always amazing! And... sorry for my ignorance, you obviously have a lot of patience with people like myself. Thank you for that too!

im not too sure about it. Im using the AV2000 and im not happy with the speeds and latency. You will be better off with moca.

powerline bandwidth drops off significantly. There is a powerline AV500 that supports the newer powerline standard. Im not sure if that tp link adapter uses it, you should check tp link's website just to be sure as it'd give better throughput and will work better in the future with other powerline adapters that uses the same standard or better.

 

[tannebil]

I abandoned Powerline for MoCa 2.0 bonded and it’s about 1000x better. In my house, any powerline connection that crossed legs in the breaker box pretty much didn’t work. Both Powerline and WiFi suffer from the issue that their environments are noisy and fluctuations in the noise can dramatically effect the performance and reliability of the connection.

Used ones on eBay are easy to find if you need to save a few bucks. Especially true if you are willing to accept the lower performance of straight 2.0 (which is still way faster than a WiFi extender or powerline). You may need to spend a few more bucks to get a MoCA POE filter and to upgrade any splitters in the MoCA path.