It Takes A Neighborhood To Fix Bad Wireless

[crashnburn]

It Takes A Neighborhood To Fix Bad Wireless
http://www.smallnetbuilder.com/wire...6-it-takes-a-neighborhood-to-fix-bad-wireless

PS: Which older version of inSSIDer are you using in the article? I don't like the new one that doesnt show both panes together below. Tell me the version and I'll try to find online or within my old HDD.

When Wireless Lans Collide - Co-operation not Collision.
http://www.smallnetbuilder.com/wire...ollide-how-to-beat-the-wireless-crowd?start=4

LETS DO A PRACTICAL RUN OF DOING THIS.

I agree. Before it was fine, but not its atrocious. Especially, when i am living in a concrete high rise area with tons of new ones sprung up around without any proper band selection etc.

Few questions:

- I want to take this article as a reference and send everyone a communication that hey we need to work together on this

What I need for that:
- Who are the people and where are they located?

Is there some way using some Site Survey Apps and some walking around that I could possibly triangulate them? Or atleast get a general direction.
The more specific of a location I can get the better it is for me to FIND the RIGHT PERSON / APARTMENT that is broadcasting in a bad way.

- Which Router/ Bands etc are they using and what is the best way we could FINE TUNE them?

Part of it would be something I'll have to do after I find these people.
BUT.. If I can roughly identify their Routers, I could do some HOMEWORK before I contact them, and share some initial configuration options that could help the Neighborhood WiFi spectrum.

e.g.
I have these following signals around me as scanned by inSSIDer:

MY OWN:
Shanghai Dare Global Technologies Co. Ltd.
- WiFi by the default Router + ADSL Modem from my ISP
- WPA2-CCMP - Max Rate - 72N (Setup: G+N) - 20 Mhz - Was originally Auto 20/40

I have a ASUS RT-N16 with Tomato USB VPN that I just bought and is turned off for now.
Will be using it soon to manage my WiFi. Disable the WiFi on ISPs Modem/Router and use ASUS-Tomato exclusively.
Which is also why I want to set it up in the right fashion, but wont be done optimally without the neighborhood co-operation.

Buffalo Inc.
- Channel 1 - WEP - Max Rate - 11

Edmax Technology Co. Ltd.
- Channel 11 - WPA-TKIP - Max Rate - 18

Ruckus Wireless (9 Signals)
- 9 of them with hidden SSIDs - WPA2-CCMP - Max Rate - 11
- And heavily crowding these channels: 4 4 4 8 8 8 8 9 9
- Seriously what is wrong with these people? As if someone just wanted to screw up the entire WiFi Spectrum around the area. Some small business office? I don't know.

I did look them up but they dont seem to sell a Router as such? Do they sell / brand their Routers/ APs through some ISP?
Anyone got an idea which brand they sell under?

I need to LOCATE these guys.. Ruckus people and work with them to fix this.

They are seriously creating a RUCKUS!

EDIT:

Suddenly early in the morning around 7 am a new signal.. just showed up.

Its as if its STRONGER than my own ISPs Wifi inside my place.

Shanghai Dare Global Technologies Co. Ltd.
- WPA - Channel 1 + 5 Max Rate - 150N

Whats wierd is its SIGNAL is off the charts! In inSSIDer its signal varies from -95 DB to Off the chart! Where I cant even see its peak. Its amplitude peak just takes over.

I am attaching Images from inSSIDer: Crazy amount of interference from this new SIGNAL.
See the yellow signal. I have no idea where its coming from.. Gotta find it.
https://picasaweb.google.com/111313...&authkey=Gv1sRgCOTbg52n-t_gXg&feat=directlink

Any suggestions and guidance, more than welcome

 

[somms]

It Takes A Neighborhood To Fix Bad Wireless
http://www.smallnetbuilder.com/wire...6-it-takes-a-neighborhood-to-fix-bad-wireless

PS: Which older version of inSSIDer are you using in the article? I don't like the new one that doesnt show both panes together below. Tell me the version and I'll try to find online or within my old HDD.

<snip>

This is why I love having all my wireless device(s) on the 802.11a (5GHz) band!

http://www.dare-tech.com/en_product.aspx?IndexID=7

That Shanghai AP is crazy...almost would make you think it is defective. Not sure anything could lock onto that seriously varying signal.

Wonder if the Ruckus AP's happen to have WPS enabled and use the same generic PIN as the Motorola Q1000!

 

[sdeleeuw]

Hi, I wrote the article on taking a neighborhood to fix bad wireless.

The laptop I used for inSSIDer is at home and I can check which version I had for you when I get back.

- Who are the people and where are they located?

My challenge was a little different than yours. In our neighborhood it's simply houses. By signal strength, walking around, a little guessing, and just talking to people I was able to determine most of them. There is also the GPS function within inSSIDer, whether it would work in your case is hard to tell, but you could give it a shot.

- Which Router/ Brands etc are they using and what is the best way we could FINE TUNE them?

The "vendor" column gives you some indication of brand, for example "Ruckus Wireless" is probably a product from here. The Shanghai device is probably one of these.

If you look more at the Ruckus site, you can see the mesh network (their words) of their devices. It's almost definitely a business using that as their wireless infrastructure. Which leads me to believe that you see much slower wireless during the day?

The bummer part is that channels 4 and 8 slightly overlap each other and they also overlap 1 and 11. By taking 4 and 8 they aren't leaving any other free channels and don't even have clear channels themselves. As a business they may not be open to your suggestions of changing to 1-6-11 without convincing them of overlap and how coordination is actually better for performance, you might show them how 4 and 8 overlap as part of your suggestion.

Can you attach the 2.4GHz channels map? If you can't find the source of 4-8 channels, or they refuse to get on to 1-6-11, it may actually be better for you to pick the less busy of the two 4 & 8 channels sadly enough. This may be a case where it's actually worth it to buy the WiSpy, or go 5GHz.

 

[stevech]

Does the neighborhood have City WiFi - Access points on streetlights or rooftops of cooperating businesses?
Or just a personal mesh.

Don't overreact to how many SSIDs you detect nor their signal strength. These are simply the WiFi 802.11 beacons. What matters if if the user of that SSID is occupying a LOT of air time transmitting. Most survey tools don't tell you this, "Channel utilzation duty cycle", 0 to 100%. Even if a neighbor streams video via WiF, and it is HD, you can simply choose a channel for your system to avoid that neighbor's WiF.

 

[sdeleeuw]

Those are good points, with the Ruckus wireless it's almost postively a business and they look to have a fair amount of devices. Granted that doesn't say how busy it is, but you can make a reasonable guess.

 

[stevech]

...Granted that doesn't say how busy it is, but you can make a reasonable guess.

How so? How do you guess as to whether that SSID does 10 minutes of email a day or streams video, unless you have a tool that displays channel utilization factors (duty cycle) ? Several do, but I've not seen one in freeware. It's easy to implement, so perhaps some freeware has it.

 

[sfx2000]

This is why I love having all my wireless device(s) on the 802.11a (5GHz) band!

http://www.dare-tech.com/en_product.aspx?IndexID=7

That Shanghai AP is crazy...almost would make you think it is defective. Not sure anything could lock onto that seriously varying signal.

Wonder if the Ruckus AP's happen to have WPS enabled and use the same generic PIN as the Motorola Q1000!

Inssider uses data from the attached adapter driver, it's not a real spectrum analyzer - my guess is that the data from the device driver is bad - not the neighboring access point...

In any event, looking at the screen shot, channel 6 is a good bet...

 

[sdeleeuw]

How so? How do you guess as to whether that SSID does 10 minutes of email a day or streams video, unless you have a tool that displays channel utilization factors (duty cycle) ? Several do, but I've not seen one in freeware. It's easy to implement, so perhaps some freeware has it.

Yeah, that's why I suggested the WiSpy... but 9 access-point type devices, and looking at an example of how the Ruckus Wireless is implemented, you can make a fair (but possibly wrong) guess that it's going to be busy... that's making a lot of assumptions of course...

 

[crashnburn]

Update:

There are 15+ signals all around. Most of them, spanning each band using Ruckus Wireless. I was thinking its a corporate but apparently some new small local ISP might be the culprit here, because one of those Ruckus Wireless signals is advertising an SSID name saying, "call ISP Wireless at 1800xxxxx".

I looked up and read up a bunch about Ruckus Wireless and their BEAM FORMING technology. I like the fundamentals they are using because I DID study Antennas and design back in engg school.

ANTENNA DESIGN & RADIATION PATTERNS:
So, I was looking up and trying to read on and understand the various antenna types now in use and which ones I could use for the Router.

http://www.data-alliance.net/Page.bok?template=antennas-omnidirectional-dipole With reference to this article I am trying to figure out the following:

- What would the combined RADIATION PATTERN look like for 3 x 2 dBi Dipole/Monopole antennas on the Asus RT N16 look like?
- How would the RADIATION PATTERN be affected if borrow one Antenna and extend it using a Cable/ Pigtail (2/3 metres) to the other LEVEL to bypass the concrete ceiling/flooring? (assuming I keep the 2dBi antenna for the 3rd or add a higher DBi 5/7 antenna).

- Any thoughts / direction on this? Should I rather discuss this with someone here on these forums on another thread topic related Antenna Design and/ or take it onto a Wifi Antenna related forum where RF Antenna design feedback and insights would be more in focus.

ALSO: SITE SURVEY & WIRELESS ANALYSIS TOOLS / APPS
I looked up WiSpy but they dont have the old $99 model anymore? Any ideas where I could get one of those?

I did find one for the Mac thats free
http://www.netspotapp.com/

How does this look?

I can install it on my Snow Leopard Hackintosh.

WiFi through CONCRETE / Managing WiFi for Concrete Buildings

More than likely I might get an extension / pigtail for one of the 3 antennas on the RT N16 to move the signal across the concrete boundary that wont let my signal travel to the other floor.

ANY ONE here.. any experiences with CONCRETE Flooring between Levels and getting Wireless to go through that?

 

[thiggins]

the $99 wispy is still available
http://store.metageek.net/Wi-Spy-24i_p_8.html

Also from other etailers.

Getting RF through concrete is difficult. You'll need to use 2.4 GHz.

 

[crashnburn]

the $99 wispy is still available
http://store.metageek.net/Wi-Spy-24i_p_8.html

Also from other etailers.

Getting RF through concrete is difficult. You'll need to use 2.4 GHz.

Nice. Thanks. On my To do shopping list.

Could you or someone guide me on the above thoughts?

Also another thing I need to do ASAP:
http://www.smallnetbuilder.com/forums/showthread.php?p=36466#post36466

 

[sfx2000]

FWIW - if you can socialize this

WiFi 2.4 GHz during a quick walkabout on my property lines... 200+ networks in 2.4Ghz - collected with Kismet on Ubuntu 11.10 with a Rokland N3 USB adapter...

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/2181814/kismet.pdf

 

[DaveMcLain]

About a year or so ago a local phone company/ISP installed fiber internet connections to a large number of homes in my neighborhood. These replaced DSL connections and when they did the upgrade they also included a new wireless router for each connection. This service was expensive and terrible and the routers were really awful and totally inadequate but what makes it really interesting is that the guys from the phone company set up each AP to use the wide channels and did so using one of the odd channels(usually channel 9). At least the wireless signals aren't very strong.

 

[System Error Message]

It doesnt really matter how many APs are on a channel rather how much a channel is being used in terms of traffic and interference however some wireless APs may be misconfigured by user or firmware in that it will broadcast in a way during idle that interferes or increases frame collisions.

 

[crashnburn]

Wow I logged on to the forums after years I guess this is still relevant

 

[stevech]

About a year or so ago a local phone company/ISP installed fiber internet connections to a large number of homes in my neighborhood. These replaced DSL connections and when they did the upgrade they also included a new wireless router for each connection. This service was expensive and terrible and the routers were really awful and totally inadequate but what makes it really interesting is that the guys from the phone company set up each AP to use the wide channels and did so using one of the odd channels(usually channel 9). At least the wireless signals aren't very strong.

If the ISP's service - using a wired PC - is unacceptable, working on fixing WiFi is n/a.

"This service was expensive and terrible"

 

[RMerlin]

Wow I logged on to the forums after years I guess this is still relevant

Quite a few necroposts this week. I guess people are bored