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Linksys E4200v2 and Tomato firmware

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Dr Strangelove

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What processor is the Linksys E4200v2 using?

Would it be able to run the Tomato firmware?

I have a Linksys E4200v1 running Tomato firmware and thus the question about the Linksys E4200v2.
 
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I am curious about this too. This router keeps on seeming to be the well balanced router that could. It is certified IPv6, UPnP, and DLNA with good to excellent performance. Well, at least v1 is. Which make me more curious about v2. Truly, at times I think about trading my RT-N56U for it. The only negative about v1 is draft N.
 
The only negative about v1 is draft N.
There hasn't been a "Draft N" router since the 11n spec was released. At that point, all "draft N" products were automatically grandfathered to release N.
 
There hasn't been a "Draft N" router since the 11n spec was released. At that point, all "draft N" products were automatically grandfathered to release N.

True. But how much is missing from draft 1 to draft 2, and then comparing the three to the ratified 802.11n? In the manner of the core logic level of support and technologies used.
 
Where do you see that the E4200 is Draft N? It was introduced long after the standard was ratified in Sept 2009.
 
The only negative about v1 is draft N.

I'm also confused by what you say, so checked the certificates. V1 is certified for 802.11n.

So is V2 (which Cisco also call the E4500 on the certificate, seems they were undecided about running it as a higher model or a replacement).
 
Just got mine today. It's a total Marvell chipset.

Cool! How is your Linksys E4200v2 performing?

The E4200V2 has a Marvell 88W8366/88W8063 wireless chipset as indicated by the E4200 wiki.

That's not going to fly with Tomato firmware then.

Not sure if there is any alternative firmware around for the Linksys E4200v2.

Given I have OpenVPN and PPTP on my Linksys E4200v1, guess I'll be sticking with it. 300/450Mbps is not so bad. :D
 
Impressions from E4200v2 owners

For those of you who have the v2, what is your impression? No reviews available yet that I could find.

They switched from Broadcom on v1 to Marvell on v2. The benefit may be no more overheating, faster 450 vs 300 MBs on the 2.4, and anything else? All my NICs are Broadcom/Intel 300MBs max, so only benefit to I can see would be future proofing and lower heat.

There is no discounting yet on the v2 router, so not convinced its worth 25% more ($200 vs $160) for those benefits unless I am missing other things. Also, Tomato doesn't seem to work on v2 since it requires a Broadcom chipset.

Thanks
 
Where do you see that the E4200 is Draft N? It was introduced long after the standard was ratified in Sept 2009.

I'm also confused by what you say, so checked the certificates. V1 is certified for 802.11n.

It is only one of the radios that mentions it. The second radio does not mention anything about what .11n it is. If the draft versions were grandfathered, then it cant be considered non-802.11n certified correct? But I guess they use only the BCM4331 for both 2.4 and 5? That [BCM4331] is recent and is ratified 802.11n. It has the recent .11n technologies in the overview.


http://www.broadcom.com/products/Wireless-LAN/802.11-Wireless-LAN-Solutions/BCM4718
It combines a Draft 802.11n CPU/MAC/baseband/radio router solution with a powerful 533 MHz MIPS32® 74KTM core and an enhanced CPU memory subsystem to increase system performance.
 
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It is only one of the radios that mentions it. The second radio does not mention anything about what .11n it is.

Radio chipsets on their own cannot be Wi-Fi Certified. You are reading marketing material intended for device manufacturers: the BCM4718 summary was written in 2008 so of course refers to itself as being "Draft IEEE 802.11n-compliant".

Only complete products and reference designs can be Wi-Fi Certified, for obvious reasons. Did you look at the E4200 certificates? That's what they are there for, they are intended for the advanced consumer. The matrix shows 802.11n certification for 2.4Ghz and 5Ghz bands.
 
widmark, you get the higher link rates only with three stream N clients.
 
Radio chipsets on their own cannot be Wi-Fi Certified. You are reading marketing material intended for device manufacturers: the BCM4718 summary was written in 2008 so of course refers to itself as being "Draft IEEE 802.11n-compliant".

Only complete products and reference designs can be Wi-Fi Certified, for obvious reasons. Did you look at the E4200 certificates? That's what they are there for, they are intended for the advanced consumer. The matrix shows 802.11n certification for 2.4Ghz and 5Ghz bands.

So, you think since there is a hardware Windows certification that the hardware in question will not fail, have lesser performance, an issue of some sort? You think since there is a BBB sticker that you as a consumer would not have issue with a business/institution? Do you think that an ADA certification means that the toothpaste is going to absolutely prevent cavities? WHQL drivers can cause an issue, but are certified.

Obviously, certification only goes but so far, and that is for a basic blanket of credibility (mainly interoperation in this context). Although, I really do believe that IPv6 Gold certification is really important, but does not mean that I will not have an IPv6 issue, of course; after all, I am about being ahead of the curve not behind.

Wi-Fi certification includes Draft 2.0 devices, and as a consumer I do not want that. I want nothing but ratified N devices that meets my standards. Even if the legacy part or device is not used I do not want legacy and older parts included within "my" device. Is this not one of the main purposes of this website and many other hardware sites to really see what is inside and logical device's function(s)?

The advanced consumer finds out what's inside first, and learns of it. Then he would be wiser to confirm compatibility, and certifications. Which only means that it is supposed to interoperate, not that it does, nor in any manner of goodness.
 
I want nothing but ratified N devices that meets my standards.

Did you look at the certificate yet? The E4200v1 has certification for the ratified IEEE 802.11n standard.

It's up to you what you think the implications and importance of certification are. I certainly have made no comments or claims about it.
 
Wi-Fi certification includes Draft 2.0 devices, and as a consumer I do not want that.

Hi Shikami, I'm only trying to help and understand. I've re-read your post a couple of times, but am a little confused what your point is.

As has been said, any device certified for 802.11n Draft 2.0 is also now automatically considered certified for 802.11n proper, because the core tests of interoperability are the same.

Optional capabilities new to the ratified 802.11n standard do not affect certification. But they are tested for and listed on the certificate. There is no better way to see how a product fits to a standard than to look at the test certificate directly.

The E4200v1 was tested after ratification. It's original certificate states 802.11n and not 802.11n Draft 2.0. It has also passed testing for all the optional capabilities of the ratified standard.

In what sense do you maintain that the E4200v1 is old or legacy or draft 802.11n? What do you think it is deficient in?
 
You guys had me in doubt so I looked up the information again to see that I and Higgin's review was correct. The BCM4718 which has to be Draft 2.0 N, obviously for Wi-Fi certification and such, is the main processor and radio for 2.4GHz.


Now, to answer your questions Rhombus:

Did you look at the certificate yet? The E4200v1 has certification for the ratified IEEE 802.11n standard.

Yes, but certification does not always show the information that can be public, or it can (e.g.): But buried in the small print is an important proviso: the three-stream 450Mbps mode is only available in the 5GHz band, and a look at the certification documents on the FCC's website (the FCC ID is Q87-E4200) reveals why: the E4200 uses a Broadcom BCM4718 router-on-a-chip, which has an integrated 2x3 dual-band radio coupled to three antennas. In the E4200, only the 2.4GHz radio is used, and the 5GHz operations are powered by a separate 3x3 Broadcom BCM4331 chip, with its own separate set of three antennas. This gives a total of six antennas inside the E4200, a solution presumably chosen because Broadcom doesn't offer a 3x3 router-on-a-chip solution at the moment. (http://www.zdnet.co.uk/blogs/zdnet-uk-first-take-10013312/linksys-e4200-450mbps-router-10021909/)

The following information could have easily been known by going to the public information of the core logic as how I do (e.g. the BCM4718): Simultaneous dual-band operation provides data rates of up to 300 Mbps in both the 2.4 GHz and 5 GHz bands. It is a 2TX, all by looking at the public informationof the chip provided by Broadcom.

But to note draft 2.0 is considered ratified. However, there are differences between draft 1.0, 2.0, and ratified 802.11n. I rather as a consumer have a fully ratified devices that is not of draft 2.0 origins.

It's up to you what you think the implications and importance of certification are. I certainly have made no comments or claims about it.
You at least inadvertently implied it when you posted: "Did you look at the E4200 certificates? That's what they are there for, they are intended for the advanced consumer." This mean (at least) that it has an affect on you for its credibility.

In what sense do you maintain that the E4200v1 is old or legacy or draft 802.11n? What do you think it is deficient in?

It may not be deficient at all. This is why I note that "myself" in the previous post is what I desired as a consumer. To me half of it is draft 2.0, has to be for certification and stated by Broadcom that it is draft. The 5GHz radiocoudl or could not be. It seems recent enough that it may actually be ratified 802.11n.

It's original certificate states 802.11n and not 802.11n Draft 2.0. It has also passed testing for all the optional capabilities of the ratified standard.

Draft 2.0 is inclusive of the ratified n. So N and Draft 2.0 are considered congruent for certification. I cannot find it, but there are some differences; minor if I am correct, but not enough for many consumers to really be concerned as I am for the products used.
 
Shikami, I wish you luck in choosing a router.

The Wi-Fi certificates are made available with the express intention for the advanced consumer to consult, and contain all the standards and tests passed. That's a fact, and all I meant to imply.

In general, in electronics, I personally don't advice any consumer to infer and rely solely on a chipset data and feature set because how the chipset is implemented in practice however frequently varies device to device, with consequent differences in performance and features.

I think I have understood now what you mean by the E4200v1 is "draft N". You mean it uses a radio chipset developed prior to September 2009. This does not make it "draft N" however.

I only wanted to correct this simple mistake you stated as fact, I think it is important to correct forum posts because many stumble across them on the internet when researching a product.

This thread was about tomato firmware, I will let it get back to that :)
 
Draft 2.0 is inclusive of the ratified n. So N and Draft 2.0 are considered congruent for certification. I cannot find it, but there are some differences; minor if I am correct, but not enough for many consumers to really be concerned as I am for the products used.

Hi Shikami

I made it through to this last point just now.

You have misunderstood about the certification. I'll give it one more try. The core mandatory tests used for 802.11n Draft 2.0 and now for ratified 802.11n are identical. There is no difference. The E4200v1 has not achieved certification by taking some different or older tests. It has passed the same tests as any other ratified 802.11n router.

Some new optional 802.11n capabilities were added to the ratified standard. All of these new capabilities (except 3-stream in the 2.4Ghz band) were also passed by the E4200v1 in its certification testing.

These capabilities are clearly laid out and listed in the certificate, you can see what they are if you consult it.
 
The fact that the Linksys E4200v2 uses a Marvell chipset, puts a bit of a dampener on this post regrading Tomato and or other alternative firmware.

Tomato firmware is not supported on this chipset at this time.
 
In general, in electronics, I personally don't advice any consumer to infer and rely solely on a chipset data and feature set because how the chipset is implemented in practice however frequently varies device to device, with consequent differences in performance and features.

Then that is bad advice, and contradictory of even this and other hardware web sites. Are you saying that you should not know if that processor supports instructions that can be necessary for for an application, or how logic can offload a processor to make the system faster, capable, complaint? It is all about the hardware, and will always be.

Shikami, I wish you luck in choosing a router.
It is easy for me. Although, the RT-N56U was a bit of an experiment due to the aging DGL-4500 I had, and also because the RT3662F processor fascinated me.

I think I have understood now what you mean by the E4200v1 is "draft N". You mean it uses a radio chipset developed prior to September 2009. This does not make it "draft N" however.

Inform Broadcom that they do not understand their BCM4718 processor and 2.4GHz radio then; and yes it draft because THEY INFORM THE CONSUMERS THAT IT IS DRAFT (It combines a Draft 802.11n CPU/MAC/baseband/radio router solution with a powerful 533 MHz MIPS32® 74KTM core and an enhanced CPU memory subsystem to increase system performance). Has nothing to do with the time of fabrication; you are also not comprehending my speculation if the information was not made public about the logic used.

According to my research for to be more knowledgeable of this difference, the difference between 2.0 and ratified can be supposedly implemented in software. There is no elaboration, nor any affect on performance mentioned of such features if implemented within software compared integrated logic, or if it matters. However, the vendor has to implement the features, to equal what is naturally supported within a ratified core logic.

A good example of what I could mean is: Many if not all of the RISC processors used for routers have no integrated FPU. When calculations of checksums have to be made it is done by many more cycles of the processor core via software rather than possible integrated hardware. Now, there are lesser cost integration into the SoC that can offload checksums, and even offload the aggregation of packets making the router faster when comparing to lesser integrated logics.


These capabilities are clearly laid out and listed in the certificate, you can see what they are if you consult it.

Your refusal to see it from the logical level is the issue. I looked at the certs, and I looked at the basic knowledge provided from Broadcom (which is very basica, BTW). I learned nothing more; they were nothing but the same to me. Think of it this way if it helps you any. I look at hardware as in a manner of lower level of coding. You view it in the higher levels. If that does not makes sense to you then my rebuttal will never be recognized/comprehended.

This thread was about tomato firmware, I will let it get back to that

I agree let the 3rd party firmware talk commence. However, it is obvious if you want the support-especially now-v1 is your choice-any OS advocate would know this. Support for the v2 could be a time of wait that never justifies itself, or may never actually come.
 

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