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Need help understanding wireless channels and bandwidth

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JxXx

Occasional Visitor
Hi,
I would like to ask some qns abt wireless channels and bandwidth.i am a newbie.so pls be patient:)
I have an ASUS ac66u.under 5ghz.i see that i can set 20/40/80,20,40 or 80.
My qn is,what is the difference between 20,40 and 80?

I set my 5hz at ch36.but i moved my mouse over to the green wifi icon at the right hand side of the router page,i see it as 36+41.what does this mean?

Thanks for the help!

Regards
 
It is a confusing topic.

The maximum link rate a client connects with depends on the bandwidth mode the router is set for and what the client supports.

This FAQ #11 has a table covering 802.11a/b/g/n link rates and bandwidth modes.

802.11ac requires 80 MHz bandwidth and supports maximum link rates of
433 MHz, 867 MHz and 1300 MHz for one, two and three stream operation.
 
rule of thumb...

Narrow Channels - better error correction, more range, good capacity
Wide Channels - better bandwidth, less range, good capacity

2 stream - good enough
3 steam - more capacity even with two stream clients (MIMO advantages)

Goes for both 2.4GHz and 5.0Ghz, and applies to 802.11n and 802.11ac
 
Hi,
thx for the replies.Sorry for the confusing topic.I will attached pictures for better picture of my qns
One of the attached is a picture of the channels summary at the top right hand corner.As you can see,5GHz has 36+42,what does that mean?

For 5Ghz,i can select 20/40/80 or individual mhz.What are the pros and cons selecting multiple vs single?
 

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One of the attached is a picture of the channels summary at the top right hand corner.As you can see,5GHz has 36+42,what does that mean?
Good question. 42 is not a valid 5 GHz channel.
This is indicating that your router is operating in either 40 MHz or 80 MHz mode. But I can't tell because the second channel isn't valid.

For 5Ghz,i can select 20/40/80 or individual mhz.What are the pros and cons selecting multiple vs single?
20 MHz is normal operation. 40 MHz binds two channels together for higher link rates and possible higher throughput. 80 MHz binds four channels together and is required for 802.11ac.

Client devices must support the same bandwidth modes or you won't get increased bandwidth.

Try this new article.
 
rule of thumb...

Narrow Channels - better error correction, more range, good capacity
Wide Channels - better bandwidth, less range, good capacity

2 stream - good enough
3 steam - more capacity even with two stream clients (MIMO advantages)

Goes for both 2.4GHz and 5.0Ghz, and applies to 802.11n and 802.11ac

I would have to disagree with some of the above.

Narrow RF channel yields lower speeds (lower capacity) plus tolerance of weaker signals. These are from the laws of physics.

Wider channels yield the opposite of the above.

802.11b/g/n all use 20MHz channel width; 40MHz is new and not practical for 2.4GHz, growing use in 5.8Ghz. The net throughput of b is less than g is less than n, though all use a 20MHz channel. It's from "adaptive modulation" which means the speed in that 20MHz varies according to the two-way signal strengths. The techniques for adaptive modulation, and "diversity" vary among b/g/n. That is, how they use the fixed 20MHz differs.

Analogy: Weak/noisy spoken communcations, crowded room/long distance, you speak more slowly to be understood. That's adaptive.
 
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Hi,
thanks for all the replies.
In regards to the 5GHz channel 36+42,i seem to always get +42 sticking ard.I changed to channel 40 and got 40+42.
When i changed to higher channel 149,i got 149+155?
 
I would have to disagree with some of the above.

Narrow RF channel yields lower speeds (lower capacity) plus tolerance of weaker signals. These are from the laws of physics.

Wider channels yield the opposite of the above.

Actually it's Shannon that discovered that - there's a limit named for him, and yes, the wider the spread of the channel, the more bits can be carried on that channel - never said it didn't :cool:

and outside of 802.11 - other access technologies have EC methods that ensure this is the case for any channel width - but the general rule is that wider channels do take more power to push the same number of bits...

In 802.11 space - the wider channels are limited by the same EC methods as the narrow channels.

I've seen real world use cases where a narrow channel in 802.11n at MCS 14 vastly outperform a wide 2 stream channel at MCS 12 or 13 - why? Less errors at a given range - the RF wasn't bad, but the noise killed the wider channel and higher frame and bit errors reduced the throughput at the network layer.

802.11b/g/n all use 20MHz channel width; 40MHz is new and not practical for 2.4GHz, growing use in 5.8Ghz. The net throughput of b is less than g is less than n, though all use a 20MHz channel. It's from "adaptive modulation" which means the speed in that 20MHz varies according to the two-way signal strengths. The techniques for adaptive modulation, and "diversity" vary among b/g/n. That is, how they use the fixed 20MHz differs.

Analogy: Weak/noisy spoken communcations, crowded room/long distance, you speak more slowly to be understood. That's adaptive.

802.11n (and 802.11ac) are much better at the near/far problem, and adaptive rate setting can be done with some chipsets on a client by client basis (and given that it's enabled in the driver).

We're singing the same tune here...

with 802.11n - I prefer throwing more streams at the problem first - better pre-coding at the AP, more EC, more actual "gain" due to the effect of MIMO precoding.

then throw bandwidth at it, but there's a point where things basically fall apart in the noise domain, and Tim's chart's show this in the 20/40MHz location values.

So the addendum to what I said earlier...

Coverage - narrow channels - better range, less bandwidth
Bandwidth - wide channels - less range, better bandwidth
and more streams are always better in both cases...

I'm trying to keep this simple, as it can and will get over the head of most folks pretty quickly, even though I think you and I could have an awesome conversation on this discussing the relative merits, and more often than not agree with each other :D

Wait until we see third gen 802.11ac chipsets - they're going to rock! Just like 802.11n as the silicon and drivers matured and more optional features were turned on.

sfx
 
Good question. 42 is not a valid 5 GHz channel.
This is indicating that your router is operating in either 40 MHz or 80 MHz mode. But I can't tell because the second channel isn't valid.

In some parts of the world, 42 is in fact a valid 5Ghz channel, just not here in the US or in Europe - but in Singapore and Israel, they're perfectly legal (also in Korea, Turkey, and Brazil) - and pairing up with 36 as primary could work, but it's an odd lineup, and some client cards might have issues there...

20 MHz is normal operation. 40 MHz binds two channels together for higher link rates and possible higher throughput. 80 MHz binds four channels together and is required for 802.11ac.

and 20MHz is mandatory for 802.11 b/g/a/n - 40 is optional for "n"

Client devices must support the same bandwidth modes or you won't get increased bandwidth.

Try this new article.

Nice article - really do hate the marketeer's with the Nxxx and ACxxx class ratings, but I suppose when at fry's/best buy/electronic stores - the 30 seconds of attention someone has with money in their pocket, they equate bigger as better.

Your charts do a good job of clearing that up, and good work there.

sfx
 
Nice article - really do hate the marketeer's with the Nxxx and ACxxx class ratings, but I suppose when at fry's/best buy/electronic stores - the 30 seconds of attention someone has with money in their pocket, they equate bigger as better.

Your charts do a good job of clearing that up, and good work there.
thanks. As misleading as they can be, the class ratings are a rare case of something that can help reduce consumer confusion...IF they know how to use them.
 
I have to clench my jaw at Fry's or Best Buy if I am in earshot range of a sales guy up-selling naive WiFi customers.
At times, I have interjected.
 
I have to clench my jaw at Fry's or Best Buy if I am in earshot range of a sales guy up-selling naive WiFi customers.
At times, I have interjected.

Man - you're not going to beat vendor spiff's - that's retail, and vendors like the big guys - ASUS, Netgear, Linksys, they know it, and they play it - tax free money in the salesman's pocket is a nice thing to have - they're not out to help out the customer... but at a less than minimum wage draw, and paid on commission, who can blame them... Retail Sales Rep, not an easy career path.

Customers have to do the research up front - research online and then go buy. SNB is a great site... I refer folks here all the time.

The others - well, sheep get slaughtered - and then they come here to dig themselves out of the hole they're in.

:cool:

sfx
 
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Retailing is nuts today - look at grocery store chains... where vendors have to pay for shelf space. Higher up, costs more. And many vendors have to come in and stock the shelves. It's crazy.
 

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