New AC Router - Which will be supported longest?

[Incarnate]

I'm looking for a new AC router to replace my existing Wireless N router. I'm most likely looking for an AC1900 router, or possibly an AC3200 depending if I can find a good deal.

It looks like some of the routers like the Netgear R7000 and Asus RT-AC68U have been out for a few years now.

Are there any recommendations on routers that will continue to receive support for a few years? I don't' want to buy a router and lose software updates and security patches in a few months or a year.

I'm leaning towards using the vendor firmware, and not using custom firmware. I've use DD-WRT on my current router today, but I don't necessarily need any of the advanced functionality.

Thanks in advance.

 

[thiggins]

Many people will tell you to use an alternative distribution (DD-WRT, OpenWRT, etc.) if you want long term support.

ASUS tends to release new firmware for its routers for years. But is also has tended to release buggy firmware that needs frequent updates.

Like other consumer products, wireless routers are a low-margin business. So manufacturing and support costs need to be kept to a minimum. The focus is always on getting new products to market, not supporting old ones. Security problems are usually (but not always) fixed. Feature upgrades, not so much.

 

[Incarnate]

Like other consumer products, wireless routers are a low-margin business. So manufacturing and support costs need to be kept to a minimum. The focus is always on getting new products to market, not supporting old ones. Security problems are usually (but not always) fixed. Feature upgrades, not so much.

I understand that totally. That's why I was asking. There don't seem to be any newer AC1900 routers that have been released recently. They are all a few years old at this point. The only newer stuff seems to be the newer MU-MIMO routers that cost a lot more.

 

[thiggins]

The Wi-Fi industry is in a bit of a flavor-of-the-month phase. Rate of change is very high. So while you will be able to buy AC1200, 1750 and 1900 class routers for years into the future, there won't be any serious development on them. New models will come from the lesser-known Chinese and Taiwanese manufacturers and focus on lower cost.

 

[sfx2000]

Many people will tell you to use an alternative distribution (DD-WRT, OpenWRT, etc.) if you want long term support.

I agree - anything that is supported by OpenWRT/DD-WRT is going to have some legs... so check their compatibility lists...

Both are still supporting the WRT54G devices, if that's any indication..

 

[RMerlin]

Like other consumer products, wireless routers are a low-margin business. So manufacturing and support costs need to be kept to a minimum.

Now that most manufacturers started offering models in the 200-400$ range in addition to your average mom&dad 40$ models, do you think it can still be considered "low margin"?

I'd be curious to see what the cost on the BOM of those typical 200$ router is.

 

[RMerlin]

The Wi-Fi industry is in a bit of a flavor-of-the-month phase. Rate of change is very high. So while you will be able to buy AC1200, 1750 and 1900 class routers for years into the future, there won't be any serious development on them. New models will come from the lesser-known Chinese and Taiwanese manufacturers and focus on lower cost.

Broadcom/Qualcomm's stockholders must be salivating now that these have managed to hit what is pretty much a yearly release cycle for new products...

 

[sfx2000]

Now that most manufacturers started offering models in the 200-400$ range in addition to your average mom&dad 40$ models, do you think it can still be considered "low margin"?

I'd be curious to see what the cost on the BOM of those typical 200$ router is.

Back in the day - 2005, an N300 Single Band - silicon contribution to the Bill of Materials was around 60%, but that included chips, software SDK, and IP licensing pass-thru for most of world - if that helps...

I think what's telling though... and I don't mean to pick on Asus, but their lineup is very straight forward... (these are all newEGG prices)

RT-AC86U - 190
RT-AC3200 - 218

Ok, so first off, we can get a feel where the WiFi chipset cost is, as both of the devices have the same WiFi chipsets, just that the AC3200 has one more - and since they're all the same chipset...

$28.00 per radio - and an AC1900 class needs two of them

We also know how lost costs can go, as we have the Tenda AC1900, which uses the same router SoC and Radio as the AC68U, and it's $109... now we take away 20 percent for conversion costs (costs to manufacture which is a fixed OPEX run rate, along with non-recurrent costs amortized over the production run) along with a 10 percent cost adder for pop-corn parts (capacitors, resisters, inductors, magnetics, sockets, plugs, RAM/Flash) and 5 percent for kitting (the box, the AC Adapter, materials like the user guide, etc). Let's add this up, and this is around 35 percent...

So $109 minus 35 percent ($38.15) - $28 per radio (56 total, see above), this puts the Router SoC at $17.85...

So the Broadcom contribution to the total router cost is around 74 dollars US in round numbers...

Going back to the RT-AC68U, at a price of $190, they're making a fair amount of coin, even after conversion costs, etc...

It's not just asus, it's others that build on the same chipset, they're essentially all the same from a HW perspective if you're looking at a Broadcom AC1900 class design - what I'm getting at is that margins are not near as thin as folks would believe...

 

[sfx2000]

So if you look at my numbers - there's 5 percent, that's tech support and marketing at the 109 price point for an AC1900 class device.

So I'd bet my hat that Asus, Linksys, Netgear, D-Link - they're making good money consider above and beyond - probably on the order of 70 percent profit - which is typical for most consumer electronics found at the BigBox online and brick and mortar stores...

Remember my background - I used to design these things - done several of them, and as part of the HighLevel design proposal, you have to build the business case around it, and this is where the numbers come from..

 

[thiggins]

Now that most manufacturers started offering models in the 200-400$ range in addition to your average mom&dad 40$ models, do you think it can still be considered "low margin"?

Thanks for the cost breakdown, SFX.

They do make good margin on new expensive routers, true. But that is not where the volume is. Manfs still sell a hell of a lot of basic N routers, which I doubt have 70% margin.

 

[stevech]

Don't overspend on WiFi.
Be a value oriented buyer.

 

[sfx2000]

Don't overspend on WiFi.
Be a value oriented buyer.

AC1900 class is the best value at the moment - most of them are now on the "friendly" side of the price curve now that AC2600/AC3200/AC ever rising numbers are the latest new hotness...

 

[System Error Message]

non consumer wifi does get supported for longer periods of time, ubiquiti mikrotik, engenius, cisco. They release less products and support them longer. The other good thing about non consumer hardware is that they arent overpriced in the UK if you buy from vendors instead of front shops like amazon, ebay, tech shops, etc.

I should probably check to see if they have an AC88U at a reasonable price, i've always wanted one. Always compare the price of the item to the price mentioned by the review. If the price of the item is much more expensive dont buy it, say no to getting ripped off. Theres no reason for items to be more expensive than mentioned, good economics should bring the price down otherwise its just a bad business or trying to rip off customers. If there is no choice in the price matter than just stick with what you have or get something else.