Switching to FiOS... Have some questions...

[LeeNYPost]

Hello all,

I'm preparing to switch to FiOS and while I'm technically decent at setting up internal networks on DOCSIS 3.0 with Time Warner (I have my own modem and 3 Netgear r7000's all working great) (2 of the r7000's are access points) I have read a ton of stuff online about how I must use the provided Actiontec router from Verizon in order for my TV (VOD, Guide and DVR) to function properly.

I honestly can't find anything in the way of articles on the main site to help with suggestions on the best way to merge this Actiontec router into my current network.. I would prefer to use an r7000 as the primary but I don't think that is possible.

I have tons of connected devices (many game consoles, 2 NAS drives, 4 tablets, 4 phones, 4 laptops, 2 desktops, etc..)

I suppose I am just looking for any info that someone can give me that has gone through trying different things with a FiOS configuration to achieve the best possible results.

Any responses will be greatly appreciated as I haven't been able to find much info anywhere.

Thanks in advance for any replies.

EDIT: I'm not concerned with wireless networking so much, I have that set, I hear the actiontec's stink for that and will be using my r7000's for all wireless needs. Anything that can be hard wired in my home is hard wired. All Gigiabit ports with Cat6 cabling... I guess I'm just worried that the Actiontec router will wind up being a bottleneck as compared to the r7000 I am currently using (which I love)

 

[Samir]

Congrats on the FIOS service. We had this in NYC when we lived out there--75/35 was 'regular'. God, I miss bandwidth like that...

Anyways, let me share some of my experiences with the actiontec. I had to put a netgear fvs124g behind it to form a site-to-site vpn for work. And I had to do this twice--once at a friend's house with FIOS, and then once at mine.

So, the router is quite flexible, but is really dummied down until you get into the advanced interfaces. The easiest thing you can do is just put your current network in the actiontec's DMZ. This way, you do have to deal with an IP address that's not the public one, but packets still get in since the actiontec isn't going to filter the dmz. Plus, you get the network you know, still set up how you like it.

 

[stevech]

In this area, a large private home area (2,000 or so homes) has an HOA that negotiated a very sweet discount for FIOS TV/Phone/Cable. Very sweet.

Modem/Router/phone all in one. I think it's mandatory per the agreement with the HOA. Can't say if Verizon will in all circumstances allow LAN side admin access. To setup port forwarding, etc. or change it to bridge mode so you can use your own router.

 

[CaptainSTX]

I use the Actiontec to provide connectivity to both set top boxes I have using MOCA.

I then have two N66Us double NATed behind the Actiontec which provide WiFi to other rooms in my home. They are connected to the Actiontec using MOCA adapters.

I use the WiFi on the Actiontec to provide a guest network and turn it on when needed.

The Actiontec router is a solid piece of hardware. I have never needed to reboot it to fix a problem. The menus to activate/ change certain features are not always intuitive but the features work. I have port forwarding set us as required (no need to use DMZ), I have DynamicDNS running and certain features controlled by the router's timer function.

I think you will be satisfied with FIOS and the Actiontec. I have the 75/35 service and 99% of the time have not problem streaming Amazon, Netflix, etc.

Enjoy!

 

[AcostaJA]

The simplest is to connect each R7000 wan port BRIDGED to an empty port on actiontec, leave the actiontec all the dhcp, nat, upnp work, configuring same SSID on R7000 but different channels (1/7/11 a. E.)

 

[AcostaJA]

If you have a Nas and requires upnp for some service and actiontec blocks it, then use an R7000 as regular router but connected to actiontec DMZ port, this router will be isolated from the rest of your network, so if you need all other routers integrated on the same net then bridge em all to the R7000 connected to the DMZ port as on my previous post

 

[AcostaJA]

An R7000 bridged to another router acts as an extension, leaving dhcp and nat work to the main router, having the same SSID means you can roam across your home without minimal interruption since each wireless ap don't change your IP

 

[AcostaJA]

Of course be aware that the R7000 nat performance *maybe* not enough for FIOS, so your first choice must be to bridge to the actiontec leaving to the actiontec all the nat work, besides being bridged you router previously must be configured with an unique static ip in the range of available ip address for manual assignment. This enables you to use other router features as file sharing etc

 

[Samir]

In this area, a large private home area (2,000 or so homes) has an HOA that negotiated a very sweet discount for FIOS TV/Phone/Cable. Very sweet.

Modem/Router/phone all in one. I think it's mandatory per the agreement with the HOA. Can't say if Verizon will in all circumstances allow LAN side admin access. To setup port forwarding, etc. or change it to bridge mode so you can use your own router.

Verizon doesn't allow any other equipment as the actiontec is their main endpoint equipment. There is no bridge mode on it like on dsl modems. It will be the edge device--no way around it.

However, it is flexible enough that I even got a site-to-site vpn working with a router behind it.

The simplest is to connect each R7000 wan port BRIDGED to an empty port on actiontec, leave the actiontec all the dhcp, nat, upnp work, configuring same SSID on R7000 but different channels (1/7/11 a. E.)

So you're basically suggesting that the R7000 just be an AP.

 

[AcostaJA]

So you're basically suggesting that the R7000 just be an AP.

Moreless, since all the dhcp and nat work will be donde by the actiontec router, allows full roam with single unique SSID, if you have some issues related to upnp just use the actiontec as a mere modem plugging your main R7000 as before with your docsis modem, with 50Mbps data plan no problem.

 

[theonlyski]

Verizon doesn't allow any other equipment as the actiontec is their main endpoint equipment. There is no bridge mode on it like on dsl modems. It will be the edge device--no way around it.

However, it is flexible enough that I even got a site-to-site vpn working with a router behind it.
So you're basically suggesting that the R7000 just be an AP.

They might not allow it, but they sure as heck aren't stopping me from doing it myself.

The only reason my Actiontec is even still connected is for VOD, TV Guide, remote DVR control and on screen caller ID.

I am using a Sophos VM as my firewall and the Actiontec sits behind it, the only traffic the Actiontec sees is from my cable boxes.


Now, that's not to say it wasn't a massive pain in the butt to set up, but it can be done and knowing what I know now, it can be done somewhat easily.

 

[azazel1024]

Verizon doesn't allow any other equipment as the actiontec is their main endpoint equipment. There is no bridge mode on it like on dsl modems. It will be the edge device--no way around it.

However, it is flexible enough that I even got a site-to-site vpn working with a router behind it.
So you're basically suggesting that the R7000 just be an AP.

Absolutely not true in anyway. It is possible it MIGHT be required for Quantum service, I am unclear on that. However, for regular FIOS, the actiontec router is 10000000% NOT required for FIOS. The actiontec router DOES have a bridge mode built in, first off.

Next, Verizon is more than willing to switch the internet on their ONT box to the ethernet port on it, so you can roll your own router without using the Actiontec in bridge mode, though you still do if you have DVRs and want them to get guide/VOD. Or you can toss the actiontec completely and get your own MoCA bridge to provide the DVRs with guide and VOD. Which is what I do.

Verizon will not SUPPORT a customers own equipment, but no ISP supports a customers own equipment. Verizon has no policy against a customer using their own equipment, nor is there anything preventing a customer from using their own equipment.

Please don't spread falsehoods.

 

[theonlyski]

Or you can toss the actiontec completely and get your own MoCA bridge to provide the DVRs with guide and VOD. Which is what I do.

How did you go about doing this? I'd love to get rid of the actiontec and the related 3rd firewall that's only there to make it happy.

ETA: I am waiting on my Quantum upgrade package that should be here today or tomorrow so if you have something you're curious about, I could probably test it. I am curious how you managed to get the DVR/Guide/VOD to work without their Actiontec. I've got the 75/75 internet already and it's working without a hitch on my firewall.

Also, you're 100% right, they won't support a single thing if it's not set up their way, but I figure for those of us who don't want to do it their way, that's the price to pay.

 

[azazel1024]

Are you running cat5/6 from your ONT to your router? Or are you using the actiontec router as a WAN bridge as well?

You must have cat5/6 from the ONT to your router to provide internet access, then you can get an MoCA bridge you want to bridge the MoCA coax traffic from your DVRs to your LAN and out to the internet. Most MoCA bridges are LAN only bridges, they can't bridge WAN traffic, so they can't provide access from your router to the ONT.

The MoCA bridge on the Actiontec routers is both a WAN and LAN bridge (WAN MoCA operates on a very different frequency from LAN MoCA is why).

My setup is Cat5e from my ONT the 100ft or so up to my garage attic, down the other garage wall, through my family room crawl space in to the basement, through the unifished part in to my basement office at the opposite corner of my house in to my router. I then have an Actiontec ECB2500 MoCA bridge sitting in the otherside of my basement in my unfinished storage room on top of my network switches plugged in to one of the switches and in to the coax for my house.

The ECB2500 was plug and play.

 

[theonlyski]

I've got Cat5 essentially going from my router to the ONT (I've got a lot of things going on with virtual machines and trunk ports, but for the sake of argument, the firewall is a dedicated PC with a direct connection to the ONT).

The coax comes in and hits a splitter that the Actiontec is plugged into. The actiontec is configured to use the ethernet WAN port and has a static IP set to what my external IP is, so I'm NAT-ing it with another firewall (really it's a low resource VM but it works).

I think the only thing I couldn't get to work without going thru this pain in the butt was remote DVR management which now that I've had this service for almost a year, I can count on one hand the number of times I've used it, so it's irrelevant to me at this point.

 

[azazel1024]

I've got Cat5 essentially going from my router to the ONT (I've got a lot of things going on with virtual machines and trunk ports, but for the sake of argument, the firewall is a dedicated PC with a direct connection to the ONT).

The coax comes in and hits a splitter that the Actiontec is plugged into. The actiontec is configured to use the ethernet WAN port and has a static IP set to what my external IP is, so I'm NAT-ing it with another firewall (really it's a low resource VM but it works).

I think the only thing I couldn't get to work without going thru this pain in the butt was remote DVR management which now that I've had this service for almost a year, I can count on one hand the number of times I've used it, so it's irrelevant to me at this point.

Okay, I think actually that is right. I think with a MoCA LAN bridge and everything else going straight ethernet from ONT to router, remote DVR will not work. That I think may be tied directly to the Actiontec router, and not a DVR/MoCA issue. However, guide and VOD as well as the other internet functions of the DVRs should work.

I've never used remote DVR.

 

[Razor512]

OP, did you get the service yet, if not, make sure you ask them to run Ethernet cable during installation. Having the ONT switched to Ethernet will work significantly better as you can now use your R7000 as the main router, and then connect the actiontec crap behind the R7000.

First use the actiontec as the main router for a minute or 2 in order to activate the STB's and remote DVR service

Log into the actiontec router, and then release the DHCP lease

Also heat to the system monitoring tab and copy your broadband MAC address. (this is needed for the remote DVR service)

To connect the actiontec router behind the R7000, first log into the actiontec router, then in the my network setting, make it look like this.

http://i.imgur.com/wHVcAIe.jpg

After that, head into the Network (Home/Office) settings, then set "IP Address Distribution" to Disabled.

After that, for the IP address, give it a new IP such as 192.168.1.250 or something else, as long as it is in the same range as your main router.


After that, apply the changes and then connect an Ethernet cable from one of the LAN ports of the actiontec router, to a LAN port on your R7000

On your R7000, connect the Ethernet cable from your ONT, to the WAN port on the R7000, then in the internet settings of the router, use the broadband MAC address of the actiontec router.

Now restart all of the STB's so that they can pull a new IP from the R7000

After that, go into the LAN settings of the R7000, then assign the DVR a static IP of 192.168.1.100

after that, forward ports (for both TCP and UDP) for the DVR
63145
63146

35000 (forward this external port to the internal port 8082)


After that, apply all changes and restart the router and STB's

Have the STB's perform a connection test to make sure they are communicating with the remote DVR servers.


The mac address is optional if you do not use the remote DVR (controlling the DVR to set recordings from the verizon website)

With all of this, everything should function normally, and best of all, you will not be stuck suffering with the actiontec router that chokes on torrents and slows over time, and has stability issues in the summer when the temperature in the room hits 100F (if the actiontec crashes, the switch and MoCA still works so the STB's don't lose connectivity)

Furthermore, when you use ethernet instead of coax, (with a better router as the main router, when you stream ondemand content (which pulls the data over the internet (verizon increases the download speed to compensate for what the on demand is using), your speed does not drop slightly, and your ping is not impacted, while with the actiontec, it is.

This is a bunch of upfront work but it is well worth it when you have far fewer connectivity issues, and better overall performance. (The benefits are especially good if you signed up for fios quantum)

 

[azazel1024]

If you are copying the MAC address, you don't have to release the IP address on the actiontec router. Just thought I'd point that out.

 

[Samir]

They might not allow it, but they sure as heck aren't stopping me from doing it myself.

The only reason my Actiontec is even still connected is for VOD, TV Guide, remote DVR control and on screen caller ID.

I am using a Sophos VM as my firewall and the Actiontec sits behind it, the only traffic the Actiontec sees is from my cable boxes.


Now, that's not to say it wasn't a massive pain in the butt to set up, but it can be done and knowing what I know now, it can be done somewhat easily.

Interesting. After reading more and seeing what you're using, looks like it is possible.

Absolutely not true in anyway. It is possible it MIGHT be required for Quantum service, I am unclear on that. However, for regular FIOS, the actiontec router is 10000000% NOT required for FIOS. The actiontec router DOES have a bridge mode built in, first off.

Next, Verizon is more than willing to switch the internet on their ONT box to the ethernet port on it, so you can roll your own router without using the Actiontec in bridge mode, though you still do if you have DVRs and want them to get guide/VOD. Or you can toss the actiontec completely and get your own MoCA bridge to provide the DVRs with guide and VOD. Which is what I do.

Verizon will not SUPPORT a customers own equipment, but no ISP supports a customers own equipment. Verizon has no policy against a customer using their own equipment, nor is there anything preventing a customer from using their own equipment.

Please don't spread falsehoods.

So corrected it would be--you don't have to use it, but you will need to spend a lot more time and money to work around it.

I've worked with this equipment, but didn't find ANYTHING on the various ways around it until this thread. And I did a hell of a lot of searching as I really needed the VPN router to be the endpoint and have all the guide/VOD stuff work.

Good to hear there is a way to do it. Now, just figure out a way to be nice when you post about it and everything will be good.

 

[theonlyski]

Interesting. After reading more and seeing what you're using, looks like it is possible.
So corrected it would be--you don't have to use it, but you will need to spend a lot more time and money to work around it.

I've worked with this equipment, but didn't find ANYTHING on the various ways around it until this thread. And I did a hell of a lot of searching as I really needed the VPN router to be the endpoint and have all the guide/VOD stuff work.

Good to hear there is a way to do it. Now, just figure out a way to be nice when you post about it and everything will be good.

The Sophos firewall I am running is free, as is the m00nwall VM that I'm using to NAT to the Actiontec, on my existing ESXi server, so there was no additional cost to me.

Now that I know the ports required to make it work and how to do it properly, it would be easy to do it again. It just comes down to a few port forwards and manual configurations and you're done (at least until your IP changes).