3 RT-AC68U's: AP Mode or AiMesh?

[follower]

Hi all, not looking to revive this thread, but I came across this 3-Pack ASUS ZenWiFi AX1800 XD4... out of curiosity, is anyone familiar with how good this setup is if doing an ethernet-plugged mesh system? Would it be better to have one of these units serve as my primary router over the RT-AC68U? There is obviously no Merlin support, but I assume the stock ASUS firmware is just as good?

I haven't had any issues since setting up the scheduled rebooter, but based on the recommendation of upgrading to newer hardware, I wasn't sure if this could be considered a worthy upgrade.

If you really want to use?
Main router + ZenWiFi.

ZenWiFi AX1800 XD4

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B08BQDTMGC/?tag=snbforums-20
The new one was $123 about 4 days ago.
Used - Very Good: $109.00.

AC68U is on sale. New $59.99.

https://www.newegg.com/asus-rt-ac68u-ieee-802-11a-ieee-802-11b-ieee-802-11g-ieee-802-11n-ieee-802-11ac-ipv4-ipv6/p/N82E16833320174

 

[darkgiants]

I already have the three AC68U's... I was mainly asking if the ZenWiFi Mesh systems are "better" than the RT-AC68U when it comes to hardware and performance. It seems to have more RAM and storage along with WiFi6 but is only dual band whereas the RT-AC68U has three bands. But the ZenWifi is also newer hardware.

Was just asking if it makes sense to upgrade from the RT-AC68U, or if it's not a significant enough upgrade over the three RT-AC68U Mesh setups I currently have.

 

[drinkingbird]

I already have the three AC68U's... I was mainly asking if the ZenWiFi Mesh systems are "better" than the RT-AC68U when it comes to hardware and performance. It seems to have more RAM and storage along with WiFi6 but is only dual band whereas the RT-AC68U has three bands. But the ZenWifi is also newer hardware.

Was just asking if it makes sense to upgrade from the RT-AC68U, or if it's not a significant enough upgrade over the three RT-AC68U Mesh setups I currently have.

AC68U definitely does not have 3 bands.

I would not consider the zenwifi systems to be great hardware or performance, just something tossed together to try and compete with the other "mesh in a box" offerings.

 

[darkgiants]

AC68U definitely does not have 3 bands.

I would not consider the zenwifi systems to be great hardware or performance, just something tossed together to try and compete with the other "mesh in a box" offerings.

Would you therefore consider the ZenWifi an upgrade over a 3 RT-AC68U system I already have just for the sake of upgrading? Or am I better off looking for something else? I don’t have any issues with my setup right now, but wasn’t too sure if this is worthy of an “upgrade” at the price, or I can do better.

 

[drinkingbird]

Would you therefore consider the ZenWifi an upgrade over a 3 RT-AC68U system I already have just for the sake of upgrading? Or am I better off looking for something else? I don’t have any issues with my setup right now, but wasn’t too sure if this is worthy of an “upgrade” at the price, or I can do better.

Personally I wouldn't. Your routers are old, but still supported (I'm using a variant still). If they are working fine for what you need, I'd hold off for Wifi7 stuff to come down and stick with a traditional router. With better routers you can probably get away with less, depending on your house and placement 2 or even 1 newer router may do it for you.

If you have a reason to upgrade now there are certain AX routers worth looking at and others that are not very good. But AXe (wifi6e) and BE (wifi 7) are both out now and should come down in price over the next year, so if you don't need more now, might as well wait and get something better for your money.

Just my 2 cents.

 

[darkgiants]

Just bumping this conversation as my current setup of x3 RT-AC68U’s (one as router, other two as AiMesh Nodes connected through Ethernet) seems to be going well with minor hiccups requiring the occasional reboot. For the sake of holding off until WiFi7 becomes more mainstream and doing a full upgrade, any sense in purchasing a RT-AC86U (second hand) for <$50 to replace as the primary router and keep the RT-AC68U’s as AiMesh nodes for the time being? Only wondering if it’s worth upgrading the primary router for now, as my speeds are not above a gig, but with more and more devices added, and the primary router requiring reboots more frequently, I figure it’s worth considering a temporary solution while I wait for more WiFi7 devices to do a complete upgrade.

Also open to other ideas to serve as a temporary solution for now.

 

[maxbraketorque]

Just bumping this conversation as my current setup of x3 RT-AC68U’s (one as router, other two as AiMesh Nodes connected through Ethernet) seems to be going well with minor hiccups requiring the occasional reboot. For the sake of holding off until WiFi7 becomes more mainstream and doing a full upgrade, any sense in purchasing a RT-AC86U (second hand) for <$50 to replace as the primary router and keep the RT-AC68U’s as AiMesh nodes for the time being? Only wondering if it’s worth upgrading the primary router for now, as my speeds are not above a gig, but with more and more devices added, and the primary router requiring reboots more frequently, I figure it’s worth considering a temporary solution while I wait for more WiFi7 devices to do a complete upgrade.

Also open to other ideas to serve as a temporary solution for now.

The AC86U is a significantly more powerful router than the AC68U in every respect. Perhaps the biggest advantage of the AC86U over the AC68U is that the AC86U has a larger amount of NVRAM which has become important because newer ASUS and Merlin FWs have a tendency to max out the AC68U NVRAM over time, especially if doing things like creating custom names for devices on the Client List window and creating manual DHCP addresses for devices. Once the NVRAM limit is reached, it can cause various issues. The only way to get it back down well below the NVRAM limit is to perform a hard reset of the router.

The primary drawback of the AC86U is that their failure rate is higher than other ASUS routers. I have four, and none have failed in the many years I've owned them, but others have had multiple units fail.

Anyhow, if you are having stability issues, you might want to consider simply switching over to AP mode. As I said many months ago, its 100% trouble-free and just works. I know the allure of AiMesh is high for many people because its new and has a nifty name, but it ain't all that great.

 

[glens]

I know the allure of AiMesh is high for many people because its new and has a nifty name, but it ain't all that great.

Ain't that the truth. It's great for grandma who doesn't give a hoot about the network performance, merely that it works at all, especially with not needing to learn and understand things about it. Plug and play even just mediocre-wise is right up a lot of folks' alleys.

 

[Tech9]

any sense in purchasing a RT-AC86U (second hand) for <$50

RT-AC86U is the router with most hardware issues. Second hand and for $50 may not be a good idea.

 

[darkgiants]

The AC86U is a significantly more powerful router than the AC68U in every respect. Perhaps the biggest advantage of the AC86U over the AC68U is that the AC86U has a larger amount of NVRAM which has become important because newer ASUS and Merlin FWs have a tendency to max out the AC68U NVRAM over time, especially if doing things like creating custom names for devices on the Client List window and creating manual DHCP addresses for devices. Once the NVRAM limit is reached, it can cause various issues. The only way to get it back down well below the NVRAM limit is to perform a hard reset of the router.

The primary drawback of the AC86U is that their failure rate is higher than other ASUS routers. I have four, and none have failed in the many years I've owned them, but others have had multiple units fail.

Anyhow, if you are having stability issues, you might want to consider simply switching over to AP mode. As I said many months ago, its 100% trouble-free and just works. I know the allure of AiMesh is high for many people because its new and has a nifty name, but it ain't all that great.

I appreciate the response! A few quick questions as a follow-up: I have been running Merlin on the primary RT-AC68U for years now, and stock ASUS firmware on the two AIMesh Nodes. If I were to switch those two AiMesh nodes to AP mode, should I flash Merlin to those two APs, or stick to stock ASUS firmware on both the APs and primary router? Not sure what kind of performance gains there may be (if any) but just curious what the recommended configuration is.

Another question: Do you have any recommended configuration or settings when using the routers in AP mode? I know keeping SSIDs in different channels is a big one, but curious if there are other things to look out for.

 

[glens]

In AP mode you'll definitely benefit from the Merlin firmware (it's fine on mesh nodes too, in my limited experience).

Use the same SSIDs and passphrases per band on both units, using different channels on each if possible. That's about it. You can salt & pepper to taste.

 

[Tech9]

In AP mode you'll definitely benefit from the Merlin firmware

And the benefit is in what exactly?

 

[sfx2000]

I have three RT-AC68U's that serve my internet needs perfectly fine for the last few years, and I believe they should continue to do my internet needs fine for the foreseeable future.

AC68U - probably time to give them the old viking funeral...

 

[darkgiants]

And the benefit is in what exactly?

I am curious about that as well. I figured maybe the ASUS stock firmware may be more "efficient" when it comes to router efficiency/hardware performance for something like the RT-AC68U (this is probably by a very minuscule amount) given the lack of options Merlin unlocks. But that's just my assumption, so open to correction on that thought.

 

[glens]

And the benefit is in what exactly?

Well, I use the /jffs/scripts and /jffs/config stuff to good purpose, as a start...

 

[Tech9]

I use the /jffs/scripts and /jffs/config stuff to good purpose

What good purpose on an access point? No routing there and the wireless drivers come from stock Asuswrt.

 

[glens]

Yes, the same drivers, and there are still things that can be done on an access point - it is a little Linux box, after all.

 

[Tech9]

Why are you not answering the questions? What exactly benefits Asuswrt-Merlin brings in AP Mode?

You told @darkgiants there are definitely benefits. Tell them how to get the benefits and what's the difference.

 

[glens]

What I said.

 

[maxbraketorque]

I am curious about that as well. I figured maybe the ASUS stock firmware may be more "efficient" when it comes to router efficiency/hardware performance for something like the RT-AC68U (this is probably by a very minuscule amount) given the lack of options Merlin unlocks. But that's just my assumption, so open to correction on that thought.

For me, having all wifi routers running the same FW is the key value of using Merlin FW on both the main and AP units. Then I only need to watch for FW updates from one source (Merlin). Similarity of GUI among all the routers is another reason, although routers running in AP mode only have a small subset of the features of routers running in "main" mode. However for the features that are running that are available, everything is going to look the same on the main and AP devices if both are running Merlin FW. And having Merlin on the APs is needed for setting up isolated guest/IOT networks.

Keep in mind that in AP mode, there is no factory means to isolate Guest/IOT networks on APs from the primary networks. If this is a big deal for you, there is a simple and a more complex way to create isolation. The easiest approach is to have separate IP address ranges for guest/IOT devices and known safe devices and then use firewall commands to prevent guest/IOT devices from talking to the known safe devices. I do this by limiting the DHCP address range to a subset of the full range of addresses and use manual DHCP address assignment for all my safe devices. The other approach is to create a Guest/IOT VLAN. This is actually pretty easy too, but it does take a bit of effort. If you want help, I can point you in the right direction.