Breaking Dad's Big Bad Gaming Discussion - For all things to do with PC Gaming !

[sfx2000]

So I wondered how I would fare at home on my gaming rig. I was hitting around 160ms reaction time using a pretty modern system with fast monitor, mouse etc. Goes to show, peripherals can make a difference.

I agree - there's a lot of things that can impact latency - going wired for Keyboard/Mouse goes a long way as we remove the wireless framing overhead.

Keyboards are interesting, as some have a limited keyboard buffer, so keystrokes can get queued/blocked when things get intense - if one is in a target rich environment in a first person shooter, e.g. outmanned/outgunned... the right peripherals is the difference between getting thru it or respawning...

 

[sfx2000]

I still have one set of Logitech Z5500 5.1 in perfect condition.

My speakers are actually an ancient 2.1 Logitech system - they're probably 15 years old, but they hold up just fine...

 

[Tech9]

they're probably 15 years old

The sound you hear is pretty old technology then. You need to upgrade your speakers and your ears to current standards.

 

[sfx2000]

My original comments in Post#201 stand. This isn't about just raw performance. This is about the environment that AMD/Intel operates in. After being burned with AMD more than once, my choice is Intel, for good reasons (already given). My point isn't AMD vs. Intel, hardware. My point is the experience once you've bought into that hardware. AMD has a lot of growing up to do, still.

Fair comments - back in the earthmover days pre-ZEN, things were a bit off compared to intel hardware.

I would suggest it wasn't just CPU's, but GPU drivers that had a lot to do with impressions - didn't help that AMD had a split shop between the ATI folks and the Green Team.

They still managed to do some interesting things - some of it kept the lights on with design wins for PS4 and Xbox back in the day for consoles...

Gen 1 Zen's were a nice reboot of the product line, and RDNA over on the GPU side - those things kind of happened in parallel, but at a good time.

And it hit at a time when Intel was stuck doing endless remakes on Skylake and trying desperately to get over to 10nm to keep their tick-tock model alive...

 

[sfx2000]

The sound you hear is pretty old technology then. You need to upgrade your speakers and your ears to current standards.

Well - I think my ears are well beyond upgrades - I'm deaf as a f**king fence post in certain frequency ranges...



Anyways - it does say a lot about the quality of Logitech, and that ain't bad...

 

[L&LD]

And to be fair, Intel needs to take some lessons from AMD on the iGPU drivers for games.

But those issues only bother those who game. I don't deal with that.

 

[sfx2000]

Intel's WiFi and Ethernet drivers have had their ups and down - been there as well...

 

[RMerlin]

Intel's WiFi and Ethernet drivers have had their ups and down - been there as well...

Particularly their Ethernet. I gave up on my onboard i225-V rev 3 (the supposedly "fixed" one) that keeps randomly disconnecting from my 2.5 Gbps switch even after installing Intel's recent driver that was supposed to include a temporary workaround to that well known issue. I disabled it last week, and installed a Realtek-based PCIE NIC. Rock stable since then.

 

[Paliv]

Particularly their Ethernet. I gave up on my onboard i225-V rev 3 (the supposedly "fixed" one) that keeps randomly disconnecting from my 2.5 Gbps switch even after installing Intel's recent driver that was supposed to include a temporary workaround to that well known issue. I disabled it last week, and installed a Realtek-based PCIE NIC. Rock stable since then.

I’ve been lucky. I have a Rev 2 on my motherboard and I’ve never seen issues…knock on wood. There’s droves of people banging their head on their desk over this one.

 

[RMerlin]

I’ve been lucky. I have a Rev 2 on my motherboard and I’ve never seen issues…knock on wood. There’s droves of people banging their head on their desk over this one.

I had issues on day one that were resolved by a driver change. A year later, I discovered there was an unusually high amount of retransmit, that seemed to mostly be OK, might have slightly affected throughput. Another driver update took care of it.

Then I upgraded my LAN to 2.5 Gbps, and all hell broke loose. Tried very old drivers and very recent ones. Latest Intel driver includes a workaround that allows disabling EEE which is the root of the problem identified by Intel, for both the i225-V and i226-V. Didn`t fix anything for me unfortunately, so I gave up on it.

To think that at the time, I was happy that Asus had decided to go with Intel for that new motherboard. Now, I might actually consider Realtek being an asset next time I upgrade my PC, unless something else replaces the i226-V and truly resolves issues.

These days, Realtek NICs are fine. They often got a bad reputation largely due to limited support by other platforms like BSD, which can be an issue for someone wanting to run, say, pfSense. For virtualization and router applications, Realtek were often more problematic.

 

[RMerlin]

For peripherals, I'm using a Corsair K68 keyboard (which I'm not fully happy with, sometimes my previous $15 membrane keyboard felt better). I do like the Cherry MX Red switches it has however - linear and quieter than blue or brown mechanical switches. Just that I frequently accidentally knock the arrow keycaps off their switches when reached for the keyboard on my keyboard drawer under my desk. The spacebar stabilizer ain`t great either.

Mouse: currently using a Corsair Darkcore RGB Pro, largely because I wanted four side buttons back then - which I rarely use anyway because they are not in a great location. It developed double bouncing buttons within 8-10 months, I fixed it by disassembling it and shooting a few droplets of WD-40 on the switches themselves. It`s been a few years and they are still working flawlessly since that.

Before that I had a Logitech G700S which I liked a lot, except for the middle button that required far too much pressure to press - my middle finger lacked the strength to quickly press it. I also liked that it came with a single Eneloop battery (which I replaced with an Eneloop Pro). It meant I could charge it over USB, or flat out swap it with an already charged battery (and these can stay at full charge in a drawer).

I might swap the mouse in the coming months, its USB plug started to be a bit iffy these past few weeks when plugging it to charge it. Unsure if I would go with the same one, or check for reviews of newer Logitech to see if the wheel click has been made softer than on the G700s. Four side buttons is no longer a need, however it needs to have a rechargeable battery. Also, Corsair's software is just as bad as Logitech's, both of them love to randomly crash when the PC comes out of sleep.

 

[Tech9]

my middle finger lacked the strength

Middle finger in gaming is important.

 

[sfx2000]

tossing more into the fire...

The X86_AMD64 handhelds - Nintendo with the Switch defined the form-factor, but like many things Nintendo...

Steam Deck

Steam Deck™

Steam Deck™ is the most powerful, full-featured gaming handheld in the world.

store.steampowered.com

And the Asus ROG Ally

ROG Ally (2023) | Gaming Handhelds｜#playALLYourgames ｜ROG Global

Unleash your gaming with the powerful ROG Ally 2023 - with a crystal clear Full HD 120Hz display, AMD Ryzen Z1 Extreme processor and sleek design, it's perfect for all your gaming needs. Discover today!

rog.asus.com

Thoughts here?

 

[Paliv]

I had issues on day one that were resolved by a driver change. A year later, I discovered there was an unusually high amount of retransmit, that seemed to mostly be OK, might have slightly affected throughput. Another driver update took care of it.

Then I upgraded my LAN to 2.5 Gbps, and all hell broke loose. Tried very old drivers and very recent ones. Latest Intel driver includes a workaround that allows disabling EEE which is the root of the problem identified by Intel, for both the i225-V and i226-V. Didn`t fix anything for me unfortunately, so I gave up on it.

To think that at the time, I was happy that Asus had decided to go with Intel for that new motherboard. Now, I might actually consider Realtek being an asset next time I upgrade my PC, unless something else replaces the i226-V and truly resolves issues.

These days, Realtek NICs are fine. They often got a bad reputation largely due to limited support by other platforms like BSD, which can be an issue for someone wanting to run, say, pfSense. For virtualization and router applications, Realtek were often more problematic.

Good to know. I had my ASUS i225-V hooked up to the 2.5 port on my ISP router for a while, but didn’t do much other than web surfing and downloading during that time and the service was only 1400/50). Now I’m nervous to go 2.5 for the network, which would only be needed for a NAS/Plex server situation. Oh well, network cards aren’t too expensive, still sucks though.

 

[Paliv]

tossing more into the fire...

The X86_AMD64 handhelds - Nintendo with the Switch defined the form-factor, but like many things Nintendo...

Steam Deck

Steam Deck™

Steam Deck™ is the most powerful, full-featured gaming handheld in the world.

store.steampowered.com

And the Asus ROG Ally

ROG Ally (2023) | Gaming Handhelds｜#playALLYourgames ｜ROG Global

Unleash your gaming with the powerful ROG Ally 2023 - with a crystal clear Full HD 120Hz display, AMD Ryzen Z1 Extreme processor and sleek design, it's perfect for all your gaming needs. Discover today!

rog.asus.com

Thoughts here?

I’d roll with the steam deck for the ecosystem, I would only get the ROG Ally if I had money to burn on tinkering, and I don’t at least not that much.

 

[BreakingDad]

I’d roll with the steam deck for the ecosystem, I would only get the ROG Ally if I had money to burn on tinkering, and I don’t at least not that much.

I would get the Deck as well, on paper the Ally is faster etc, runs windows; in theory allowing the use of more store fronts. But it's using Asus's Armoury Crate as a launcher on top of 11 , and anyone who has ever used that trash bloatware will understand why I don't want to use that. That's not to say SteamOS is perfect, apparently it's also buggy as hell rn as well.

I also think, from what I've read, that the controlller sticks and buttons are a lot better on the deck than the Ally.

I don't know, the Ally feels like an expensive "cheap" immitation to me.

 

[RMerlin]

I don't know, the Ally feels like an expensive "cheap" immitation to me.

I would rather think that the Ally is a "Gen 2" device compared to the Steam Deck. It has a new revision of AMD's SOC, runs much quieter, and has a slightly better screen (if I recall).

The software side is where the Steam Deck probably still has the advantage, since they actually developed a game-centric OS to handle it, while Asus has to work within the limitations imposed by Windows. Plus, Asus has never been a great software company (like the vast majority of hardware manufacturers who handle software as a necessary evil rather than an asset), while Valve has an history as a software developer.

 

[sfx2000]

I would rather think that the Ally is a "Gen 2" device compared to the Steam Deck. It has a new revision of AMD's SOC, runs much quieter, and has a slightly better screen (if I recall).

I wonder if they share the same ODM team - power and thermal management on a handheld device like this cannot be trivial...

 

[sfx2000]

Now I’m nervous to go 2.5 for the network, which would only be needed for a NAS/Plex server situation. Oh well, network cards aren’t too expensive, still sucks though.

One would hope that drivers could fix the whole Intel thing with that chip... esp. since it is Intel's chip and they know ethernet as well as the next guy...

Unless one is moving massive amounts of data around, one isn't going to really notice any difference - Gbe is more than enough to handle multiple 4K plex streams...

 

[RMerlin]

I wonder if they share the same ODM team - power and thermal management on a handheld device like this cannot be trivial...

I'd be surprised. Asus already has long-time established partnerships. Pegatron for instance - I believe they changed name over the years. Asus probably has the internal know-how that Valve doesn't, so Valve might be relying more heavily on external designs.

AMD's newest SoC is a beast at low wattage. The Ally can be set to run the SoC at 9W, 15W or 25W. Modern heatpipe and vapor chamber designs are pretty impressive. Remember those Pentium 4 laptops back in the day that weighted 6-7 pounds, lasted 4 hours and sounded like a jet engine? These days you can get high performance out of a 4-6 pounds laptop, and it will run much quieter.