Finally Sick of UBNT. Need AP -Without- Corp. Network

[keenanj]

Yeah I am a cloud skeptic for this kind of things though. I see the value of the mobile app for some use cases but I even much prefer not to need one at all.

There is also a app for the EWS377AP called enwifi it will let you make changes to a unmanaged AP

 

[keenanj]

I just tested the iPhone 12 pro with the ECW230 / EWS377AP got over 800Mb down on a 1G connection. https://www.keenansystems.com/wordpress/2020/10/24/iphone-12-pro-wi-fi-6-speed-testing/

 

[rafale77]

Very nice. Thanks for reporting. I am honestly very happy with my version 1 EWS377AP units and am just curious as to what rev2 and rev3 provide. It seems like rev2 potentially would be equivalent of the ECW230 with a different ethernet chipset? And rev3 is a completely different PCB with an updated chipset IPQ8072A.

 

[coxhaus]

My new iPhone 12 works great on my Cisco network with Cisco wireless WAP581 APs. I have not done any testing but I have not seen any issues either.

 

[keenanj]

Very nice. Thanks for reporting. I am honestly very happy with my version 1 EWS377AP units and am just curious as to what rev2 and rev3 provide. It seems like rev2 potentially would be equivalent of the ECW230 with a different ethernet chipset? And rev3 is a completely different PCB with an updated chipset IPQ8072A.

The only changes are to the Ethernet port performance is the same on v1 and v3 units.

 

[Flak]

The only changes are to the Ethernet port performance is the same on v1 and v3 units.

You are wrong sir. Or Engenius is wrong as this is what I got from them including links to the FCC filings.

ews377ap v1 is obviously the original version and using Qualcomm IPQ8072.
ews377ap v2 fixed a potential bug with the 2.5gb port only running at 1gb internally.
ews377ap v3 has more ram per Engenius. And according to the FCC filings, lower power ratings.

 

[rafale77]

and again v3 has an updated chipset: IPQ8072A vs. IPQ8072 of the v1/v2. The A version of the qualcomm chip is a significant update as it enables OFDMA in both directions. The FCC filing pictures shows a completely different PCB as well.

 

[keenanj]

Guys I did a review and some speed testing on the EWS377AP V3 here https://www.keenansystems.com/wordpress/2020/10/27/ews377ap-v3-4x4-wi-fi-6-access-point-testing/

Not any faster for single stream then the V1 units but has some additions that should help business users.

 

[bleomycin]

You are wrong sir. Or Engenius is wrong as this is what I got from them including links to the FCC filings.

ews377ap v1 is obviously the original version and using Qualcomm IPQ8072.
ews377ap v2 fixed a potential bug with the 2.5gb port only running at 1gb internally.
ews377ap v3 has more ram per Engenius. And according to the FCC filings, lower power ratings.

and again v3 has an updated chipset: IPQ8072A vs. IPQ8072 of the v1/v2. The A version of the qualcomm chip is a significant update as it enables OFDMA in both directions. The FCC filing pictures shows a completely different PCB as well.

Yeah, I also checked the FCC listing as well to confirm the new chipset. I ordered 2 of these directly from engenius as they allow for easy returns as it's my first experience with the brand and no way i'm paying a restocking fee or worse if they suck, V3 hardware showed up. Good news is that performance is fantastic, pulled 920+ Mbit/s wth iperf on my iphone 11 pro max out of the box. Never thought i'd see a phone push nearly gigabit speeds, so awesome. Range and roaming has been excellent, handoff between both units for voip calls is seamless and running an MTR on the iphone during roaming drops 0 packets. Overall still in the honeymoon phase but if it keeps up they are vastly superir to the aruba IAP-225's they replaced and i'll be ordering more to replace the remaining Aruba's.

The EzMaster management software is basic and kind of crappy (doesn't reload elements after changes automatically) but it is serviceable and assuming everything continues to just work i'll hardly have to touch it anyways. Engenius gave me a free skykey with my order. Would have been nice to have an iphone app that can talk to the EzMaster "controller" but i guess they're reserving that functionality for their cloud offering. I can't see paying a $210 premium per AP for slightly better management software, seems kind of insane unless it fills a very specific need for you, especially considering its identical hardware (fcc confirms this).

 

[rafale77]

I am now tempted to get some rev3 units to replace my rev1... will first need to validate whether I have the gigabit bug... but otherwise have been very happy with my rev1 units.

 

[bleomycin]

I am now tempted to get some rev3 units to replace my rev1... will first need to validate whether I have the gigabit bug... but otherwise have been very happy with my rev1 units.

Just out of curiosity what is wrong with the Rev 1 units that would compel you to buy the new revision? I also noticed the tp-link EAP660HD is running the IPQ8072A as seen here: https://fccid.io/TE7EAP660HDV1/Internal-Photos/18-Internal-Photos-4970103

The tp-link management software looks a little more polished and they have a phone app that appears pretty decent as well. Wonder how they stack up to EnGenius overall?

 

[rafale77]

Nothing wrong with the rev1. The two potential reasons would be:
1. Being bottlenecked by the internal gigabit limitation bug which I still need to test to see if I am affected. A back of the enveloppe calculation shows that actually 2.5gbe uplink is about just right for a 3600mbps wifi AP assuming ~70% throughput efficiency which the best wifi APs are able to hit (unifi are by far the worst in this category from my own testing especially the gen2 but the gen3 are getting there with <50% when most get around 60-65%)
2. The full compliance with wifi6 with bidirectional OFDMA but this is secondary as I don't have too many wifi6 devices at the moment.

The mobile app is the least of my concerns as I am looking to get decent control from a local/on premise controller which the EZmaster fulfills.

 

[bleomycin]

Nothing wrong with the rev1. The two potential reasons would be:
1. Being bottlenecked by the internal gigabit limitation bug which I still need to test to see if I am affected. A back of the enveloppe calculation shows that actually 2.5gbe uplink is about just right for a 3600mbps wifi AP assuming ~70% throughput efficiency which the best wifi APs are able to hit (unifi are by far the worst in this category from my own testing especially the gen2 but the gen3 are getting there with <50% when most get around 60-65%)
2. The full compliance with wifi6 with bidirectional OFDMA but this is secondary as I don't have too many wifi6 devices at the moment.

The mobile app is the least of my concerns as I am looking to get decent control from a local/on premise controller which the EZmaster fulfills.

Ahh interesting, so you're using 3+ stream clients, nice! Again, I have 0 experience with the tplink stuff but they do appear to have a local controller as well that runs either on their hardware or can be installed on windows/linux: https://www.tp-link.com/us/business-networking/omada-sdn-controller/omada-software-controller/

 

[rafale77]

Yes I do have 3x3 clients. I also use wifi to stream quite a few IP cams and a variety of other uses so the total bandwidth matters. The TP link offering is one more I could consider. Thanks!
I have been looking at Aruba, Zyxel and Engenius...

 

[coxhaus]

What 3 x 3 clients do you have? Are they Apple?

The new Cisco CBW240ac wireless APs look good and are fairly cheap. I have a couple of Cisco WAP581 APs that work well with all our Apple devices and a couple of security cams. I have 2 more cams to setup that are inhouse just no time right.

 

[rafale77]

yup, a couple of rMBP. Indeed, I looked at Cisco too (9115AX and 9117AX) but the offering was a bit on the expensive side. Looking forward to the new APs!

 

[Krisbi]

Guys I did a review and some speed testing on the EWS377AP V3 here https://www.keenansystems.com/wordpress/2020/10/27/ews377ap-v3-4x4-wi-fi-6-access-point-testing/
Not any faster for single stream then the V1 units but has some additions that should help business users.

Thank you for the review. Nice throughput. That´s with 2x2 MIMO, correct? Could you please check whether the access point has airtime fairness options available? (https://www.smallnetbuilder.com/wir...-to-the-tr-398-wi-fi-performance-test?start=1) I haven´t found anything about it while reading the datasheets.

 

[keenanj]

Thank you for the review. Nice throughput. That´s with 2x2 MIMO, correct? Could you please check whether the access point has airtime fairness options available? (https://www.smallnetbuilder.com/wir...-to-the-tr-398-wi-fi-performance-test?start=1) I haven´t found anything about it while reading the datasheets.

Yes 2x2 Wi-Fi 6 IOS and windows clients I do not know of any 4x4 client devices yet to test with. You can put these things into mesh mode and bridge at full speed also. Not sure about airtime fairness I will check with my engineers.

 

[Krisbi]

Yes 2x2 Wi-Fi 6 IOS and windows clients I do not know of any 4x4 client devices yet to test with. You can put these things into mesh mode and bridge at full speed also. Not sure about airtime fairness I will check with my engineers.

Great, thank you. Btw. have you already benchmarked the new EWS357AP v3 version with its new Qualcomm IPQ6010 chipset?

 

[keenanj]

Great, thank you. Btw. have you already benchmarked the new EWS357AP v3 version with its new Qualcomm IPQ6010 chipset?

I tested the ECW220 here

ECW220 Cloud Managed 802.11ax WiFi 6 2×2 Indoor Wireless AP – Keenan Systems Wi-Fi

It is the same as EWS357AP I do not expect any performance difference with the v3 version is single client speed testing.