Good Bandwidth Control Router

[Midnite8]

Hey guys, I am looking for a good router that has great bandwidth control. I want to limit the amount of bandwidth going to my 2 roommates. Right now I am running a Netgear WNDR3700 v1. I bought a TP-Link Archer C7 v2, I know the Archer has bandwidth control features but not sure if whether I want to get a different router or not.

 

[abailey]

What are you trying to limit your roommates from? If you are talking limiting them from internet bandwidth, no consumer router can really do this. As soon as the data leaves your network, your equipment looses control of it. The ISP will strip any QOS from the data. If you trying to limit your roommates speed to a media server on your network or something like that, then this is possible.

 

[Midnite8]

I don't want them to hog all the WAN when they are downloading or streaming. Say for example my Internet speed is 15MBps, but I want to limit them to only be able to hit say 2MBps max. Is this not possible?

 

[abailey]

I don't want them to hog all the WAN when they are downloading or streaming. Say for example my Internet speed is 15MBps, but I want to limit them to only be able to hit say 2MBps max. Is this not possible?

Unfortunately no. It is sad that the manufacturers of the consumer routers do slick marketing that leads you to believe their routers can do this. The problem is there is no way for your ISP to throttle some of the traffic it sends to your router. In fact all the traffic from your network comes from one IP and MAC address (your routers) so to your ISP it looks like one machine. To try to throttle it at the router as it comes back in is too late as it has already passed through your internet line and taken up bandwidth.

 

[Trip]

If TP-Link's factory firmware bandwidth controls aren't cutting it, then I'm afraid you might have to rely on the 3700, perhaps using DD-WRT, as I believe third-party firmware support for the C7v2 is pretty slim at this point. So you could potentially do the wired routing and traffic shaping/throttling on the 3700, then use the C7 as a wifi access-point.

If you're thinking of purchasing a new router, though, then perhaps a shibby TomatoUSB-compatible one? I feel like I'm pimping that left and right recently (trust me, it's not my sole aim...) but I've had pretty nice luck with its QoS and bandwidth-throttling. You definitely want ample CPU for governing multiple bandwidth-intensive clients (even just the two for now...), so something like an R7000 might be the way to go there.

Other options, depending on budget and effort/skill level, would be higher-level business-class stuff like an EdgeRouter Lite or MikroTik models. Neither, especially MT, I would consider to be novice-friendly.

So to recap, I'd first try the Archer's built-in feature set. If that doesn't cut it for whatever reason, then use DD-WRT on the 3700 to route and throttle, and use the Archer as the AP. If it's still not satisfying, then look into tomato-compatible hardware (WNR3500Lv2, R7000, etc.). And lastly, business-class gear.

 

[abailey]

Now you can throttle their upload speed if that is the problem, like if they are running a torrent server, but you can't throttle download from the WAN.

 

[azazel1024]

Now you can throttle their upload speed if that is the problem, like if they are running a torrent server, but you can't throttle download from the WAN.

Yes you can. You can throttle ingress and egress bandwidth per IP address or IP address range through the C7 (and a lot of routers that have bandwidth control). Depending on the router, it is not a fine grained instrument, as I've seen them vary +/-20% or so from the set value, but you CAN do this.

4.17 of the C7 Archer user manual. I do understand asking question, like if you aren't sure exactly how to set it up or how it works...but look at the manual, or even just in the admin webpage. It is one of the main tabs, "Bandwidth Control"!!!!

 

[abailey]

Yes you can. You can throttle ingress and egress bandwidth per IP address or IP address range through the C7 (and a lot of routers that have bandwidth control). Depending on the router, it is not a fine grained instrument, as I've seen them vary +/-20% or so from the set value, but you CAN do this.

4.17 of the C7 Archer user manual. I do understand asking question, like if you aren't sure exactly how to set it up or how it works...but look at the manual, or even just in the admin webpage. It is one of the main tabs, "Bandwidth Control"!!!!

My mistake on wording. Yes some consumer routers can do this and almost all pro router can do this (like the Ubiquiti Edgerouter I use). But it does not work as intended, meaning you should not do it. The only way to throttle or limit incoming bandwidth from the WAN connection is either to drop packets or try to buffer them. The buffer, even in pro routers, is not enough to buffer the incoming stream enough to effectively slow down the speed of certain PC's. What will happen if you try is the buffer will quickly fill up and then it will start dropping packets. This will cause the sending side to have to resend the packets, thus taking up even more bandwidth than if you had not enabled it. Yes the actual download speed to the PC will be throttled but it will not free up bandwidth on your internet line, and in fact will most likely cause additional bandwidth to be used because of packets being resent. This is what I am talking about when I talk about slick marketing that these manufacturers do. They put these settings on their routers so they can then advertise them, but they do not work like they are advertised.

 

[thiggins]

These are a bit dated, but worth a read.
Taming Your Network's Bandwidth Hogs - Part 1

Taming Your Network's Bandwidth Hogs - Part 2

 

[Midnite8]

So basically the general consensus is that it isn't impossible, just not effective.

 

[abailey]

So basically the general consensus is that it isn't impossible, just not effective.

If you already have the router I say give it a try. azazel1024 talks about the Archer C7 and said there is some adjustment that can be made. I assume it does this by buffering the TCP acknowledgement and delaying it so the sending source does not send more data until it gets an acknowledgement.

It would not be the first time I have been wrong. About a month ago I told someone on this forum that you cannot create 2 VLANs and have machines in different VLANs talk without a router. Well I was wrong about that because I was unaware of the "General" port setting. Coming up through Cisco we always had access or trunk ports but not general ports. Well with general ports you can make machines in two different VLANs talk if they are in the same subnet (without a router).

So give it a try, just don't be disappointed if it does not work as well as you would hope.

 

[thiggins]

So basically the general consensus is that it isn't impossible, just not effective.

Bandwidth shaping is very effective. It is done all the time in corporate and hospitality (hotel/motel) networks.

 

[azazel1024]

If you already have the router I say give it a try. azazel1024 talks about the Archer C7 and said there is some adjustment that can be made. I assume it does this by buffering the TCP acknowledgement and delaying it so the sending source does not send more data until it gets an acknowledgement.

It would not be the first time I have been wrong. About a month ago I told someone on this forum that you cannot create 2 VLANs and have machines in different VLANs talk without a router. Well I was wrong about that because I was unaware of the "General" port setting. Coming up through Cisco we always had access or trunk ports but not general ports. Well with general ports you can make machines in two different VLANs talk if they are in the same subnet (without a router).

So give it a try, just don't be disappointed if it does not work as well as you would hope.

I assume that is how it is working it, but not really sure.

As for effectiveness, it seems to be pretty effective, again from what I have heard. On my one router I have bandwidth control and never touched it, on my other one, I do not have bandwidth control (current router).

It should be effective. I mean, it is possible it doesn't work at all. My only mention of the variation is that in playing with bandwidth limiting on switches, and a handful of reviews of switchs AND routers that have actually tested bandwidth control, it seems to work well, its just that it might not accurately represent what you get.

For example, on my TP-Link SG2216 switch, if I set a 50Mbps port limit, I find I actually get around 54Mbps through the port. Setting a port limit of 20Mbps, I got 18Mbps through the port.

It is that kind of thing. So if you want to set very exact bandwidth limitations, that might not be possible, at least not without trial and error. However, you SHOULD be able to set "targets", and the limits should be pretty close to those targets.

Going with QoS to shape bandwidth based on what service is going in/out from the router is much more difficult and with consumer routers is often not terribly effective. bandwidth shaping on a CLIENT level is generally pretty effective.

 

[Midnite8]

I'll just stick to my wndr3700, I dont think I want to go through that much trouble in doing it since it isn't that big of a deal. Thanks for the advice guys

 

[Trip]

Not a bad call. With the v1, there are probably specific builds of OpenWRT or DD-WRT which will at least give you the building blocks for the controls you desire. Good luck!

 

[sfx2000]

Bandwidth shaping is very effective. It is done all the time in corporate and hospitality (hotel/motel) networks.

There is a tremendous amount of traffic shaping in the broadband to end-user world - from DeepPacketInspection (DPI) to very flexible Policy Rules/Policy Enforcement engines to MultiProtocol Label Switching.

It's about ensuring fairness across all subs for all content (dark side here is to favor one provider perhaps over another, e.g. over the top solutions vs. in-house deployments vs. "fast lane" peering relationships)

This is very different from basic Quality of Service tagging, as these traffic shaping tools go well beyond this.

sfx

 

[azazel1024]

I'll just stick to my wndr3700, I dont think I want to go through that much trouble in doing it since it isn't that big of a deal. Thanks for the advice guys

Huh? you said you already had the Archer C7. Why not try it out? It is litterally like a 10 minute thing to set it up and throw in some settings for bandwidth control and see if it works for you. It certainly SHOULD. It isn't like it is going to cost you further money or serious effort.

 

[Midnite8]

I have an opportunity to grab a R7000 for only $100 or even a N66U for $ 50 so I might try either out. Roommates telling me they get bad signal from the router. My room is through the garage and when the router was in the kitchen(now in my room), only 30 ft away, I would have the same problem.

 

[Midnite8]

So I decided to just keep my Archer C7 but unsure if I did the bandwidth control correctly. I accessed Bandwidth Control->Control Settings and enabled bandwidth control. There is a line that says: Line Type: ADSL or Other. I chose other since I have Comcast. Then I went to the Bandwidth Rules Control and input the Min and Max kbps on the IP address of the computer.

 

[azazel1024]

Sounds like you did it right.

Did you try something like speedtest.net before and after to see if it had any impact?