Intel WIFI 7 BE200 Adapters $20 3-5gbps

[Tech Junky]

https://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Intel/BE200NGWGNV?qs=Imq1NPwxi768LH5kQoGXsA%3D%3D

Coming soon!!!!! It's a good sign when you find a model # and listing.

 

[L&LD]

I have a feeling that WiFi 7 is going to steamroll out faster than anything before it.

 

[Tech Junky]

With the market treating 6E as a red headed stepchild I think you're spot on. 6ghz makes sense for few but, w/o any bump in speed on 6E it was just pointless except for a few use cases. The premium for the gear didn't make sense. 6/E speeds still topped out at 1.4gbps using an AX411 card.

BE doubles that obviously w/ 320mhz on 6ghz and MLO

It's just nice to spot the HW / price though some of the info out there seems to push that there's more than one version of HW which is why the speed of 3-5 came up. I was figuring 3gbps based off the AX411 performance. 5gbps would be a perk for LAN connectivity though some people are crazy enough to get ISP plans in that range as well.

In an office setting you could conceptually get those speeds if they upgrade their APs but, I doubt they would allow unlimited BW for a single user to hit those max speeds.

Now, that the pieces are coming together it's time for companies to make APs and avoid the atrocious costs of the current BE offerings.

 

[coxhaus]

With the market treating 6E as a red headed stepchild I think you're spot on. 6ghz makes sense for few but, w/o any bump in speed on 6E it was just pointless except for a few use cases. The premium for the gear didn't make sense. 6/E speeds still topped out at 1.4gbps using an AX411 card.

BE doubles that obviously w/ 320mhz on 6ghz and MLO

It's just nice to spot the HW / price though some of the info out there seems to push that there's more than one version of HW which is why the speed of 3-5 came up. I was figuring 3gbps based off the AX411 performance. 5gbps would be a perk for LAN connectivity though some people are crazy enough to get ISP plans in that range as well.

In an office setting you could conceptually get those speeds if they upgrade their APs but, I doubt they would allow unlimited BW for a single user to hit those max speeds.

Now, that the pieces are coming together it's time for companies to make APs and avoid the atrocious costs of the current BE offerings.

Yea, I don't think you will see much 320mhz with the big guys as they have to support to many connections. We will probably see more connections at low BW so they can handle more connections and active talkers. I would think they will be looking for 10 gig data connections since there is so much 10 gig out there.

 

[follower]

I'm ready to use be200. I'm expecting WiFi 8. Yes. But I don't think a lot of users are using even 802.11ax. That's the problem.

 

[Tech Junky]

802.11ax. That's the problem.

The problem is companies keep the market saturated with old tech instead of switching to the newer tech to mo e things along.

Think DDR 5 for instance. If you want an AMD setup you are forced to upgrade for the 7000 series CPU. Intel on the other hand caved to allow both 4/5 to be used. Even now Intel boards can use both and not sure when they will force the issue until ARL most likely. DDR 5 price points now are reasonable where they weren't when ADL launched a couple of year ago.

The same goes for chip makers still producing legacy wifi cards. If you want adoption and penetration you have to kill the old supply. For instance the bar has been set to use W11 if you want super speeds as it won't work in w10 or older. USB has the same issue.

 

[follower]

The problem is companies keep the market saturated with old tech instead of switching to the newer tech to mo e things along.

Think DDR 5 for instance. If you want an AMD setup you are forced to upgrade for the 7000 series CPU. Intel on the other hand caved to allow both 4/5 to be used. Even now Intel boards can use both and not sure when they will force the issue until ARL most likely. DDR 5 price points now are reasonable where they weren't when ADL launched a couple of year ago.

The same goes for chip makers still producing legacy wifi cards. If you want adoption and penetration you have to kill the old supply. For instance the bar has been set to use W11 if you want super speeds as it won't work in w10 or older. USB has the same issue.

FCC ID PD9BE200NG

fcc.report

 

[sfx2000]

Coming soon!!!!! It's a good sign when you find a model # and listing.

For those folks running Windows - I hope you like Win11...

Sounds like Win10 is not going to support WiFi7...

 

[L&LD]

With Windows 12 on the horizon, that isn't surprising in the least.

 

[d5aqoep]

Any news on Intel BE200 release?

 

[Crimliar]

I'm struggling to get the WiFi 6E AX210 to work with (just) one of my RK3588 SBCs.

 

[coxhaus]

I'm ready to use be200. I'm expecting WiFi 8. Yes. But I don't think a lot of users are using even 802.11ax. That's the problem.

I have a lot of wireless ax devices but I have no 2.5 gig ethernet except my old Cisco wireless 581 AC APs which I replaced with Cisco 150ax APs.

 

[Tech Junky]

2.5 gig ethernet

That would be a bottleneck considering BE allegedly does 5ge. No news on APs yet so they'll either be 5/10ge ports. Maybe someone will invent 20ge since the total bandwidth is projected to be considerably higher between the three radios combined.

 

[coxhaus]

The only 5 gig ethernet I know is the old Cisco SMB 500 switches. I am pretty sure they were 5 gig instead of 10 gig on the upload ports.

I hope they are 10 gig as 5 gig would be more of a problem for me.

For higher bandwidth we would have to use fiber optic cable. I don't think fiber optic would go over well having it on your AP. They probably would not sell well. And I think copper cables have been cheapen so much there is no way they can go to a higher bandwidth then 10 gig ethernet.

 

[drinkingbird]

That would be a bottleneck considering BE allegedly does 5ge. No news on APs yet so they'll either be 5/10ge ports. Maybe someone will invent 20ge since the total bandwidth is projected to be considerably higher between the three radios combined.

There is 25G-baseT but it is pretty rare, but maybe it will find its place in the future. Basically the limit of what copper can do realistically at this point. 40G copper also exists in theory but have never seen anything that implemented it. 50G-BaseT was also part of the same draft as 25G but I don't think anything has come of it. Its just 25G with more encoding, so it may come around some day.

Will be interesting to see when we start seeing more fiber used in the home. Single strand with WDM could actually be much easier to run to an AP or from ONT to router than a copper cable.

 

[drinkingbird]

The only 5 gig ethernet I know is the old Cisco SMB 500 switches. I am pretty sure they were 5 gig instead of 10 gig on the upload ports.

I hope they are 10 gig as 5 gig would be more of a problem for me.

For higher bandwidth we would have to use fiber optic cable. I don't think fiber optic would go over well having it on your AP. They probably would not sell well. And I think copper cables have been cheapen so much there is no way they can go to a higher bandwidth then 10 gig ethernet.

They can go as high as 40G (in theory) and 25G (in practice, though currently pretty rare). No need to go to fiber to exceed 10G.

 

[Tech Junky]

@coxhaus @drinkingbird

Just thinking out loud. In practice having ports match the top speed of the AP would at least be a step forward from the junk being peddled with every generation. I know most of it's marketing but, with the 2.5GE port I can hit 1.7 on a single client. Projections on BE though put the single client ta 5GE so, of course the mesh systems solution is to put 10GE ports on them from what has shown up so far in the draft options. Fiber would be nice though if it were a bit sturdier for use outside of putting it in trays tor some protection from users. If they could put it in a simple DAC cable with the transceivers already welded on and thicker coax jacket for protection there might be a solution for the masses. The only issue then becomes sizing things properly rather than pulling it off a spool and putting the ends on it.

I think most could figure out how to plug in a fiber though if they had separate transceivers. The issue there though or in both cases is making sure the device is unlocked for any brand to be used and not locked down to specific options. Considering how cheap people are with networking though they will scoff at the $50/module plus the fiber cost. I mean I see it all the time around here with people wanting a $30 router to perform like a $600 model. The WIFI cards though being priced the same as AX should usher in adoption as things age out.

I already have a glimpse by using the AX411 which has the dual band bonding ability that BE is touting as a feature. The only issue with it is that you have to have a recent Intel CPU / board to make it work as they didn't release a PCIE version. It does what it's supposed to do when needed and bumps the speed up.

In general though if companies would drive down the prices of 10GE gear they would sell more and we would all reap the benefits of not having to deal with slow networks. Intel is even pushing 5GE on the next round of MOBOs. Not sure what AMD is aiming for though. Of course there's MTK/RTL adapters in the works but, those sometimes take a couple of gens to figure it out and not cause issues.

 

[drinkingbird]

@coxhaus @drinkingbird

Just thinking out loud. In practice having ports match the top speed of the AP would at least be a step forward from the junk being peddled with every generation. I know most of it's marketing but, with the 2.5GE port I can hit 1.7 on a single client. Projections on BE though put the single client ta 5GE so, of course the mesh systems solution is to put 10GE ports on them from what has shown up so far in the draft options. Fiber would be nice though if it were a bit sturdier for use outside of putting it in trays tor some protection from users. If they could put it in a simple DAC cable with the transceivers already welded on and thicker coax jacket for protection there might be a solution for the masses. The only issue then becomes sizing things properly rather than pulling it off a spool and putting the ends on it.

I think most could figure out how to plug in a fiber though if they had separate transceivers. The issue there though or in both cases is making sure the device is unlocked for any brand to be used and not locked down to specific options. Considering how cheap people are with networking though they will scoff at the $50/module plus the fiber cost. I mean I see it all the time around here with people wanting a $30 router to perform like a $600 model. The WIFI cards though being priced the same as AX should usher in adoption as things age out.

I already have a glimpse by using the AX411 which has the dual band bonding ability that BE is touting as a feature. The only issue with it is that you have to have a recent Intel CPU / board to make it work as they didn't release a PCIE version. It does what it's supposed to do when needed and bumps the speed up.

In general though if companies would drive down the prices of 10GE gear they would sell more and we would all reap the benefits of not having to deal with slow networks. Intel is even pushing 5GE on the next round of MOBOs. Not sure what AMD is aiming for though. Of course there's MTK/RTL adapters in the works but, those sometimes take a couple of gens to figure it out and not cause issues.

I can see fiber in the home someday, but it will need to be something standardized that you don't have to buy SFPs for, and it will all be pre-made cables. Similar to when you get fiber internet, they bring a couple lengths and run from the pole, if there is slack there is a bracket on the back of the ONT to wrap it around. Unless they miraculously come out with an inexpensive termination machine (good luck) I don't see people terminating their own fibers. There are plenty of good rugged fiber patches out there in varying lengths, in theory one could wire their whole home pretty easily (but not cheaply) now. But until it is determined what the standard will be, not really worth it. Fiber internet is typically delivered with a single strand SC connector with WDM. LC is the standard in commercial environments. They may come up with some sort of more rugged screw on connector for home use. Who knows, will wait and see.

But in the meantime they're still going full speed ahead with copper. I think 5G is probably a dud, seems like it will likely go right from 2.5 to 10 for most stuff. But then there is 25 and 40, and even 50 in theory (but not yet in practice). Pretty sure they've even tested 100G over a very short distance in a lab somewhere. I'm sure they can keep pushing it further and further with encoding schemes but at some point encoding causes too much latency and too much sensitivity to noise at which point fiber starts to make a lot more sense.

I think it will be a long time before we start to see >10G in the home anyway. Just because a BE router can do more than that, no different than what we have now, wireless capability rarely lines up with wired ports on home routers.

Just like everything, 10G (or at least 10G-BaseT) will come down, it already has by a lot. Just supply and demand, 2.5 is more common now and those switches are coming down to where 1G ones were not that long ago.

While SFPs are great, I agree that the cost is likely going to drive fixed port solutions. 10-20 years maybe we'll have home switches with a mix of 10G copper and fixed fiber ports selling for $25.

 

[L&LD]

10GbE is already too low speed for ports on a 'true' and fully capable WiFi 7 wireless router.

As I said elsewhere, the manufacturer that offers the balanced hardware 'required' for full WiFi 7 performance throughout the network (LAN and WAN), will be on my shortlist. I'm hoping it's Asus. And also dreaming of RMerlin support on that router too.

 

[drinkingbird]

10GbE is already too low speed for ports on a 'true' and fully capable WiFi 7 wireless router.

As I said elsewhere, the manufacturer that offers the balanced hardware 'required' for full WiFi 7 performance throughout the network (LAN and WAN), will be on my shortlist. I'm hoping it's Asus. And also dreaming of RMerlin support on that router too.

Eh, if I'm expecting 10G of wireless throughput today, I'm not expecting it from a home router. In a couple years maybe. We know how it goes with these technologies, they put in a 10G port or even wireless chipset before the rest of the hardware (backplane, CPU, etc) is actually capable of fully supporting that. Their excuse will always be, well it gives more than a gig (or 2.5) and that's what was needed, we never said it would get a full 10G of throughput.

I guess like any technology, investing big money up front usually isn't the way to go, get a better version for half the price when it matures a bit.

Lets be realistic too, there are very few who are going to benefit from that kind of wireless throughput even with a lot of devices.