Large house Mesh system

[adder70]

We have a fairly large house (~5,000 sf) with drywall and wood stud walls. 2 Story plus basement. We presently have a surfboard modem (I'm guessing the 686Mbps variety) and an 800 Mbps ISP plan.

We were using a TP-Link Deco system with 3 nodes that tested to about 320Mbps close and 220Mbps far, vs a newer Asus ZenWifi XT9 with 2 nodes. (I thought it was interesting that both main and satellite nodes rated in the 800s close by, but the main node tested to 350 or so at 30 ft, while the satellite node tested to 600Mbps at 30 feet.) We're having trouble with random disconnects that seem to be more common on the main node, not the secondary router. I'll be searching for a better control channel (although it's an intermittent problem so hard to "test") tonight when nobody is working.

We have the money to spend if needed but want to limit our expenditures on this. Everything seemed ok but not great with the Deco routers. Occasionally slow but not horrible. MUCH better with the Asus until the random disconnects started happening. Our gamer son was especially aggravated because the lapses got him kicked on multiple occasions. They were significantly worse with the routers after we moved the satellite about 5 feet. After going back to the old routers, we realized the spacing issue may have been the cause. However, with them reinstalled closer together, the momentary (10 seconds or less) disconnects are still happening. It's a big problem because my wife and I have both had business calls affected by the disconnects.

Do we need a 3rd router? Seems like it's not reception related since close clients are being disconnected. Defective router? Or is this system not up to our use, or not reliable/stable?

Looking for buying (if replacement/addition is needed) and troubleshooting advice. We are open to getting the 1200 Mbps plan and a gigabit modem (Surfboard S33) but don't want to if it isn't necessary.

 

[Tech9]

We have the money to spend if needed but want to limit our expenditures on this.

Then you have to live with what this "trash can" design units can do. Some are better, some are worse, none with wireless backhaul are great. Paying for faster ISP line won't help. Paying for professional installation of needed number of wired access points is the only great solution. You get what you pay for. You can save some money if you know how to do it yourself. Otherwise will cost you few thousands and you have great Wi-Fi in your great home.

 

[Viktor Jaep]

Do we need a 3rd router? Seems like it's not reception related since close clients are being disconnected. Defective router? Or is this system not up to our use, or not reliable/stable?

Looking for buying (if replacement/addition is needed) and troubleshooting advice. We are open to getting the 1200 Mbps plan and a gigabit modem (Surfboard S33) but don't want to if it isn't necessary.

We have a fairly large house... not 5000sqft large, but I ended up with a pretty interesting setup. I didn't want to lose the capability of being able to play with my Asus-Merlin router running custom scripts, but I certainly didn't want to deal with Asus's horrible implementation of AiMesh. So what I ended up doing is using my Asus router as the main border router (connected to our ISP modem), and have a 4-node Google Nest Wifi Pro system sitting behind it. This is the main home network that my family uses, and provides those great smart Google Home capabilities with our IoT devices, and gives people control with the Google Home app to manage devices. This setup provides a stable network for our family, while I can play, tweak, protect, and funnel selected traffic from our home network over a whole-home VPN.

So in short... I highly recommend the Google Nest Wifi Pro system... It's plug and play. It just works. You plug it in, and don't have to touch it. It updates itself... no downloading firmware yourself. There's not a lot of options or ways to do any kind of custom stuff... but it's really good with the basics if you just want something that works. We have no problem with drops or speed... you probably want to use a good 4 or 5 nodes to adequately cover your house. They say their 3 node setup could cover 6600sqft, but I prefer strong signal strength. Good luck with your situation!

https://store.google.com/product/nest_wifi_pro?hl=en-US

 

[Tech9]

One of the best home "mesh" systems indeed, but not cheap.

 

[adder70]

Then you have to live with what this "trash can" design units can do. Some are better, some are worse, none with wireless backhaul are great. Paying for faster ISP line won't help. Paying for professional installation of needed number of wired access points is the only great solution. You get what you pay for. You can save some money if you know how to do it yourself. Otherwise will cost you few thousands and you have great Wi-Fi in your great home.

I don't need the performance of hard wired lines. We have considered that. However, when we aren't having the brief disconnect issues, this setup appears to have plenty of bandwidth for our uses. The Deco units, which are notably slower, were close to enough. (This is why I mentioned the better plan and modem as an option I don't think we need.) If we need a bit more coverage or a more stable system, we can do that. To use a car metaphor, I'm looking for something to improve from base Civic performance to maybe muscle car performance. In fact, strong sedan performance would be fine. We definitely don't need top fuel dragster performance.

 

[adder70]

One of the best home "mesh" systems indeed, but not cheap.

Does this refer to the Nest system, or the reply indicating that I should wire the whole home?

 

[adder70]

We have a fairly large house... not 5000sqft large, but I ended up with a pretty interesting setup. I didn't want to lose the capability of being able to play with my Asus-Merlin router running custom scripts, but I certainly didn't want to deal with Asus's horrible implementation of AiMesh. So what I ended up doing is using my Asus router as the main border router (connected to our ISP modem), and have a 4-node Google Nest Wifi Pro system sitting behind it. This is the main home network that my family uses, and provides those great smart Google Home capabilities with our IoT devices, and gives people control with the Google Home app to manage devices. This setup provides a stable network for our family, while I can play, tweak, protect, and funnel selected traffic from our home network over a whole-home VPN.

So in short... I highly recommend the Google Nest Wifi Pro system... It's plug and play. It just works. You plug it in, and don't have to touch it. It updates itself... no downloading firmware yourself. There's not a lot of options or ways to do any kind of custom stuff... but it's really good with the basics if you just want something that works. We have no problem with drops or speed... you probably want to use a good 4 or 5 nodes to adequately cover your house. They say their 3 node setup could cover 6600sqft, but I prefer strong signal strength. Good luck with your situation!

https://store.google.com/product/nest_wifi_pro?hl=en-US

I'll look into the Google Nest system if we don't have any luck with the ST9 troubleshooting. Again, it's a weird problem that doesn't seem to affect systems far from nodes or the main router, or when it's busy. My phone dropped this morning with nobody else awake and 12 feet away from the main router (through the floor, but still) when doing basically nothing. I just glanced and saw a notification that internet connection was lost.

You say it's plug and play. You can still make changes, right? i like simple implementation, but I stay away from Apple because they limit what you are allowed to do, not just what you need to do. And not being forced to use a mobile device like TPLink Deco. When I realized yesterday that I could use a PC to make changes and actually started using it, I thought of how many options I might look into changing. Then I checked myself. First, fix the broken things. Then, think hard before you fix what ain't broke!

I've done the more involved set up of things in the past so I understand how to do things (I'll qualify that with I understand the principles and old tech, so the help forums usually give me what I need.) but I would just rather pay a bit more (not $3,000 to wire the whole home, but $400 vs $200 is fine) and have simplicity, with the option to change things if I choose.

 

[Tech9]

Does this refer to the Nest system, or the reply indicating that I should wire the whole home?

Wire and business class access points is better.

 

[Viktor Jaep]

I'll look into the Google Nest system if we don't have any luck with the ST9 troubleshooting. Again, it's a weird problem that doesn't seem to affect systems far from nodes or the main router, or when it's busy. My phone dropped this morning with nobody else awake and 12 feet away from the main router (through the floor, but still) when doing basically nothing. I just glanced and saw a notification that internet connection was lost.

There's all kinds of reasons why this can happen... wifi interference, overlapping, misconfiguration, firmware issues, being near radar, etc.

You say it's plug and play. You can still make changes, right? i like simple implementation, but I stay away from Apple because they limit what you are allowed to do, not just what you need to do. And not being forced to use a mobile device like TPLink Deco. When I realized yesterday that I could use a PC to make changes and actually started using it, I thought of how many options I might look into changing. Then I checked myself. First, fix the broken things. Then, think hard before you fix what ain't broke!

Absolutely... you have control over various features directly from within the Google Home app. There's no web or PC interface... truly, it's very simple, and all the necessary items (like setting SSIDs, pwds, testing network/mesh performance, managing devices, kid schedules, notifications, and setting more advanced items for LAN/WAN/DNS, uPNP, etc all can be found there. But like I said, it's simple, just works, and keeps itself updated. Don't have to mess with what channels to pick - it figures all that out on its own.

I've done the more involved set up of things in the past so I understand how to do things (I'll qualify that with I understand the principles and old tech, so the help forums usually give me what I need.) but I would just rather pay a bit more (not $3,000 to wire the whole home, but $400 vs $200 is fine) and have simplicity, with the option to change things if I choose.

I believe I got my Google Nest Wifi Pro 4 pack at Costco... https://www.costco.com/google-nest-wifi-pro,-wi-fi-6e,-4-pack.product.4000053084.html

They're going for $449.99 right now if you're a member!

An extra Wifi Point can be had for $99 at Best Buy: https://www.bestbuy.com/site/google...5400-mesh-router-snow/6522668.p?skuId=6522668

 

[coxhaus]

Build a small business network. It will build the foundation you want. It can be custom tailored to any set up and size.
You can install Pfsense on an old PC for free and buy a few Cisco 150ax wireless APs for $102 each. This builds a good cheap foundation much better than any consumer router. And probably cheaper in a large sized house.

 

[ajp2k14]

We have a fairly large house... not 5000sqft large, but I ended up with a pretty interesting setup. I didn't want to lose the capability of being able to play with my Asus-Merlin router running custom scripts, but I certainly didn't want to deal with Asus's horrible implementation of AiMesh. So what I ended up doing is using my Asus router as the main border router (connected to our ISP modem), and have a 4-node Google Nest Wifi Pro system sitting behind it. This is the main home network that my family uses, and provides those great smart Google Home capabilities with our IoT devices, and gives people control with the Google Home app to manage devices. This setup provides a stable network for our family, while I can play, tweak, protect, and funnel selected traffic from our home network over a whole-home VPN.

So in short... I highly recommend the Google Nest Wifi Pro system... It's plug and play. It just works. You plug it in, and don't have to touch it. It updates itself... no downloading firmware yourself. There's not a lot of options or ways to do any kind of custom stuff... but it's really good with the basics if you just want something that works. We have no problem with drops or speed... you probably want to use a good 4 or 5 nodes to adequately cover your house. They say their 3 node setup could cover 6600sqft, but I prefer strong signal strength. Good luck with your situation!

https://store.google.com/product/nest_wifi_pro?hl=en-US

I guess you have disabled the wifi on the Asus router then? We’re moving to a much bigger apartment in a couple of days. Today I’m using an AX86U which works fine where we are now but I ordered an AX86U Pro intended to be the master in AImesh (wireless, no cables possible). I’m having doubts this will be enough or work well though and then I found this post from a respected member and started thinking about a plan B.

 

[Viktor Jaep]

I guess you have disabled the wifi on the Asus router then? We’re moving to a much bigger apartment in a couple of days. Today I’m using an AX86U which works fine where we are now but I ordered an AX86U Pro intended to be the master in AImesh (wireless, no cables possible). I’m having doubts this will be enough or work well though and then I found this post from a respected member and started thinking about a plan B.

No, I've left the wifi on... For dev purposes and for the purposes of devices needing direct WAN access (like the TV).

 

[ajp2k14]

No, I've left the wifi on... For dev purposes and for the purposes of devices needing direct WAN access (like the TV).

Ok, thanks!

 

[Viktor Jaep]

Ok, thanks!

Just in case I didn't explain why above, the reason for certain devices needing direct WAN access is because the Google Nest Wifi Pro network goes out over a whole-home VPN via the GT-AX6000.

 

[sfx2000]

We have the money to spend if needed but want to limit our expenditures on this.

That's a big house - I would actually recommend finding a pro to do some planning...

they'll do a site survey and ask some serious questions about your use cases

If you can afford it, it's a worthwhile investment.

 

[coxhaus]

Put holes in your ceiling and mount wireless access APs. It will be a much better-looking installation. Do you have a wiring closet? If not, I would pick the top of a regular closet and make it your where you terminate all your cables for your wireless.

A pro installation would be best. If you are going to do it yourself then string cables along the floor as you are figuring out where to mount your APs. A starting point will be 1500sq ft for 2.4 and 700sq ft for 5Ghz, then adjust from there based on walls and doorways. Line of site is sometimes key for long runs.

 

[jaizan]

Put holes in your ceiling and mount wireless access APs.

What would you recommend & at what system cost ?
The other little question is does the recommended system automatically move the user onto the best AP as he moves around the building ?

 

[Tech9]

automatically move the user onto the best AP

No system moves the user automatically. This is not how roaming works. Some systems use additional technologies to encourage the client switching to better AP, but can't direct the client to specific one. The decision where to connect is on the client side. The consumer AiMesh you are looking at in another thread has very basic tools to assist roaming and it gets worse with mix and match routers.

 

[coxhaus]

What would you recommend & at what system cost ?
The other little question is does the recommended system automatically move the user onto the best AP as he moves around the building ?

What I did at my old house. I use a closet high shelf for modem router and switch. I drilled a hole into the attic large enough to push a patch cable through. Then I drilled a hole in the ceiling of the room where I wanted an AP. I attached the AP's mount to the ceiling and plugged in the RJ45 jack into the Cisco AP. It is pretty easy. I just buy patch cables long enough for the room I want it in. I used 1 big hole for the switch where all the cables home run to and then filled it.

I did not want to run wire and certify it. I do not have a proper tester and they are too expensive to buy. I use a certified patch cable long enough. I think I used a 1/2 inch hole. It might have been 5/8 inch but it was a while back and I don't exactly remember. Once you have all the cables run you can fill the hole with spray foam. I have a long fiberglass rod that stick up through the hole so I can find it in the attic.