Major problems with home network, I'm desperate for help

[road hazard]

I recently posted in the Asus 1900P topic about asking the difference between v1 and v3 hardware. Well, the reason I was looking for a new router (because I assumed it was my routers fault) is because I'm at my whits end trying to resolve a big problem with my home network and the new router didn't help at all and is just adding to my misery. Help?

For the past few days, I've been having a MAJOR problem with my home network and can't figure it out. I have a router (DIR-880L) that operates a 2.4GHz and 5GHz wireless network. Plugged into that, is a 8 port gigabit switch. Plugged into the switch is a server and desktop PC. Attached to the DLink 880L are 2, Intel NUCs using 802.11ac.

Up until recently, I could copy files from any PC to any other PC and the transfer rate was around 100MB/s to 120MB/s. Maxing out my gigabit router/switch. I could push a 10+ gig .MKV file from my server to the Intel NUCs over 802.11ac and get around 90-100MB/s. I could copy that same file between my server and desktop PC (both on the switch) and get the same speed.

A few days ago I noticed that file transfers from the server to my PC were slow.... averaging around 60MB/s. I went upstairs and checked the NUCs and noticed the same. They were only getting around 60MBs from the server. Something else I noticed that was weird, if I disconnected the network cable that fed the switch (so the NUCs were the only things on the network and both were talking to the router at 802.11ac speeds) ..... copying a 5 gig file between them resulted in the same, weird 50-60MBs speed. (They use to average 100MBs when copying files back and forth a few days ago.)

Also, when I went into the 'Homegroup' (all PCs are running Windows 7), neither PC could see each other. Thinking it was a router problem, I bought a new ASUS RT-AC1900P from Best Buy (I think it's just a faster version of the AC68U?) and when pulling from the server.....the speeds are all over the place.... 10MBs, 20MBs.... they were at 60MB/s but from messing around with the router, the speeds are staying sub-20MB/s and I have no idea how to at least get back to 60MB/s. No PCs have malware.

Using Inssider, I don't see any overlap of network (I live in a small neighborhood and my house is sorta isolated so I don't think it's any sort of interference.) The ONLY thing I can think of that started this..... my wife was dusting and moved the wireless router and I noticed this because when I was on my PC downstairs, my HP software popped up a warning about how "scan to PC functionality was gone because the printer was offline". I came up stairs to check the router and she said she just moved it for a second.

Every since that day, things were weird. Our wireless camera would go off the deep end and not see the network. My daughters iPod would not be able to get on the 2.4GHz network.... our laptop would sometimes drop off the 2.4GHz network. So, I factory reset the DLink router and manually entered all the wireless networking info and things are better but still have the crap LAN transfer speeds between PCs. Any ideas?

 

[wouterv]

A few hints:

1. A bad router power supply (although two routers seems to behave the same what I can make out of your story).
2. Other disturbing factors: micro wave, a bluetooth device, a DECT telephone, other electronics.
3. Weather conditions.
4. Climate at the router location: make sure it has sufficient ventilation, put the router on a hard surface and not inside a closet.
   
5. Router antenna orientation.
6. Double check for new disturbing factors: brick walls, concrete walls, concrete floors, steel objects, water filled objects. Keep the router away from those.
   
7. No idea where you are located. maybe DFS plays up on 5 GHz. Try to set the router fixed to one of the following non DFS 5 GHz channels: 36, 40, 44 or 48.
   
8. A bad LAN cable (either the cable itself or one of the RJ45 connectors).
9. Double check your whole house with InSSIDer (make sure the laptop you use for that support 802.11ac), make sure there is no channel overlap at all locations.
   
10. Check the router system log for any helpful messages.

All the rest your story is a bit too long and vague to make conclusions.

 

[road hazard]

A few hints:

1. A bad router power supply (although two routers seems to behave the same what I can make out of your story).
2. Other disturbing factors: micro wave, a bluetooth device, a DECT telephone, other electronics.
3. Weather conditions.
4. Climate at the router location: make sure it has sufficient ventilation, put the router on a hard surface and not inside a closet.
   
5. Router antenna orientation.
6. Double check for new disturbing factors: brick walls, concrete walls, concrete floors, steel objects, water filled objects. Keep the router away from those.
   
7. No idea where you are located. maybe DFS plays up on 5 GHz. Try to set the router fixed to one of the following non DFS 5 GHz channels: 36, 40, 44 or 48.
   
8. A bad LAN cable (either the cable itself or one of the RJ45 connectors).
9. Double check your whole house with InSSIDer (make sure the laptop you use for that support 802.11ac), make sure there is no channel overlap at all locations.
   
10. Check the router system log for any helpful messages.

All the rest your story is a bit too long and vague to make conclusions.

1) Two routers, same result so nah, don't think that's the problem.
2) No new household devices added.
3) Same weather it has been, sunny. (House thermostat set at 74)
4) The router and NUCs are all on the same desk. A few feet from each other.
5) Tried a few different ways, same result.
6) Nothing new.
7) Tried them all, same result.
8) The only electronic devices I had powered on were the two NUCs, the cable modem and router. I attached both NUCs to the 802.11AC network and when copying a big file between them, 10MB/s, 30MB/s.... total crap. BUT, if I plug both NUCs into the router via LAN cable, I see the speeds I'm use to seeing....100+MB/s when copying a big file back and forth. (I did this same test with the old and new router.....same exact result.)
9) Saw no overlap.
10) Nothing stood out at me.

 

[sfx2000]

A bad router power supply (although two routers seems to behave the same what I can make out of your story).

Could be the switch - bad power supply there would impact the whole network - or the switch itself might be going bad (it's rare, but it does happen)...

If changing out routers doesn't improve things, look at the other common element..

 

[road hazard]

Could be the switch - bad power supply there would impact the whole network - or the switch itself might be going bad (it's rare, but it does happen)...

If changing out routers doesn't improve things, look at the other common element..

I think the switch (for now) can be ignored. Maybe I have multiple problems all happening at once?

Lets break things down smaller. I powered everything off in my house that was computer tech/electronic. I have my old router and new one. Nothing else is plugged into them, not even the cable modem. Just a power cable. When either router comes up, it's only broadcasting 5GHz. I attach both NUCs to the 802.11ac network of the old DLink and and when copying a large 10+ gig file between them, the xfer rate is 10MB/s, maybe 20MB/s, 60 at the high end but usually starts/stays around 20-40MB/s. Powered that router off and re-did my test with the new Asus router, same results.

The router is on a desk with nothing around it and the NUCs are on either side (couple of feet away). Any idea why the speeds between these 2 devices would be so horrible? Before this nightmare started, pushing files back and forth at 100+MB/s was normal and same speed when pulling from the server.

 

[KenZ71]

Why use wireless if the devices can be connected via ethernet?

Any chance at all a neighbor setup a newifi network, cordless phone, etc?

 

[sfx2000]

I think the switch (for now) can be ignored. Maybe I have multiple problems all happening at once?

I respectfully disagree - you had problems with the old router and the new router, and the symptoms did not change, which means it was not the router - the next common element in your network is... tada...

The SWITCH - take it out of the loop and see if the problem continues - basic troubleshooting 101...

Then you can look at environmental things - but I've seen first hand switches fail like this...

 

[road hazard]

Why use wireless if the devices can be connected via ethernet?

Any chance at all a neighbor setup a newifi network, cordless phone, etc?

Just want a clean looking setup. I think I'm going to pick up a cross over cable tomorrow for some more troubleshooting and go PC to PC.

 

[road hazard]

I respectfully disagree - you had problems with the old router and the new router, and the symptoms did not change, which means it was not the router - the next common element in your network is... tada...

The SWITCH - take it out of the loop and see if the problem continues - basic troubleshooting 101...

Then you can look at environmental things - but I've seen first hand switches fail like this...

Already replaced the switch, same result. Another huge problem, why is it that when I disconnect everything and only have the two NUC's on the 5ghz network, they can only transfer files back and forth at 20MB/s? I think figuring out that would be a decent clue to the overall bigger problem.

 

[sfx2000]

Maybe you should draw a pic so folks can understand how you are linked up...

https://draw.io

Very helpful here...

 

[road hazard]

Maybe you should draw a pic so folks can understand how you are linked up...

https://draw.io

Very helpful here...

http://imgur.com/a/4PVZo

 

[ColinTaylor]

http://imgur.com/a/4PVZo

Hopefully you don't have a cable going directly between the server and the PC?

 

[wouterv]

At first, as said by Colin: there should NOT be a cable between your server and the PC!
Second, as said by sfx: disconnect that switch completely and try a file transfer between the NUCs.

More step-by-step trials:

• Move the NUCs a little further from the router and from each other (say 10 feet).
• Power one NUC at a time, connect the switch, and only connect the wired PC to the switch: now copy back and forward from the one NUC to the PC. Do this for both NUCs.

[EDIT]
One more thing: are you sure the file copy is the only cause of data traffic to and from the router, and Internet?
Are the NUCs free of malware?
At least the Asus router offers you a traffic monitor: shut down all browsing and file copies, close all programs on the NUC and watch the data traffic, it should be close to nothing.

 

[FTC]

Hi, what data rate do your NUC ac cards support ? if it is lets say 600mbps, then your teorethical max data rate to transfer files between NUCs is 600/8 (8 bits per byte)/2 (info travesls 2 times through same air channel, once NUC1->router, and second router->NUC2) = 37.5MBPS, but wifi is quite inefficient so getting 20MBPS in this case would be in fact quite good..

 

[road hazard]

Hopefully you don't have a cable going directly between the server and the PC?

Nope, I got a little crazy with the arrows. The server and the PC are NOT hard wired together.

 

[road hazard]

At first, as said by Colin: there should NOT be a cable between your server and the PC!
Second, as said by sfx: disconnect that switch completely and try a file transfer between the NUCs.

More step-by-step trials:

• Move the NUCs a little further from the router and from each other (say 10 feet).
• Power one NUC at a time, connect the switch, and only connect the wired PC to the switch: now copy back and forward from the one NUC to the PC. Do this for both NUCs.

[EDIT]
One more thing: are you sure the file copy is the only cause of data traffic to and from the router, and Internet?
Are the NUCs free of malware?
At least the Asus router offers you a traffic monitor: shut down all browsing and file copies, close all programs on the NUC and watch the data traffic, it should be close to nothing.

I responded to somebody else about it and no, the server and PC downstairs aren't connected directly. I just went crazy with that flowchart program........ and I was just stressed out.

With the switched disconnected, transferring files between the NUCs still results in speeds that range from 5MBs, sometimes 20MBs, 40....the best I ever saw was around 50MB/s but it slowly dropped to 20MBs.

Your idea on only hard wiring the NUCs one at a time and unplugging everything from the switch is a good idea, will try that tonight if I get some time. Who knows, maybe something else on the switch is causing problems?

More about that though.... if I copy a file from my PC to NUC # 1 (everything hard wired), it transfers at 100MB/s the entire time. Same test with NUC # 2 (again, hard wired), the speeds are 50-70MB/s, but usually stay around 50. Repeating the same steps with the NUCs wireless........ speed to NUC # 1, 30-50MB/s. Speed to NUC # 2, same. So from this, it seems the wired and wireless card in NUC # 2 might be damaged and the wireless card in NUC # 1 is damaged. EXCEPT....... if I hard wire both NUCs into the router and do a file transfer from 1 to the other...........90-100MB/s solid the entire time!

Nothing has malware. Used countless programs to check and everything is clean.

Here are some constants. At no time, from my PC to the server or the server to hard wired (or wireless NUCs) is the server capable of pushing files at more then 50MBs. I'm going to test a direct connection from the server to my PC with a cross over cable and if the speeds are crap, the NIC is getting replaced. This would solve some of the mystery. It's a Asrock H97 MPro 4 and has been running a Plex server 24x7 for nearly 2 years straight. Maybe the NIC/board is slowly dying?

Another constant.... the NUCs (when using 802.11AC) can't receive a file from anything at anywhere near their theoretical max.

During all these tests, the cable modem was off and disconnected from the router.

I did watch the traffic in the Asus router and it reported what I was seeing. If I saw slow or fast network traffic, it represented it perfectly.

 

[road hazard]

Hi, what data rate do your NUC ac cards support ? if it is lets say 600mbps, then your teorethical max data rate to transfer files between NUCs is 600/8 (8 bits per byte)/2 (info travesls 2 times through same air channel, once NUC1->router, and second router->NUC2) = 37.5MBPS, but wifi is quite inefficient so getting 20MBPS in this case would be in fact quite good..

My NUCs connect to 802.11AC at 866Mbps (I think that was the link speed.) So judging by that, if I turn off one of the NUCs and transfer files from my PC to that NUC on wireless, can I expect 90MB/s?

And maybe this is my lack of understanding of 802.11AC, I'm fairly certain I was able to transfer files between the NUCs on 802.11ac at 90MB/s but I can't honestly recall testing that in the months leading up to this. If what you're saying is correct, then I guess it's normal to see a file transfer between these NUCs give me 40MB/s?

Check out my other post. Another wrench in the plans........ copying a file from my PC to either NUC (when they are on wireless) results in 30-50MB/s (or around that). If NUC 1 and 2 are on, and using 802.11ac..... even though I'm not copying a file to both, will the existence of the second NUC on 802.11ac still cause the file transfer to slow down just by being turned on?

 

[FTC]

Hi, if you copy from a wired PC to a wireless device with 866Mbps max data rate then the Max teorethical throughput would be just 866/8 = 108 MByte/s, which mean a real speed of something more than half that data (or about 60MB/sec would be reachable) once we take out all the protocol induced overhead, but take into account that this is with the link speed established at 866... note that most times the link speed is negotiated slower due to interferences, distance, echo, lack of antennas/bands in one part. or just bad reception by one of the ends and then the real throughput gets even worst.

Regarding slowdowns induced by other devices connected but not transmitting, no, there should be no measurable slowdowns.

 

[wouterv]

Hmm mega bits and mega bytes confusion?
Rough rule of thumbs:
1 mega byte per second = 8 mega bits per second (usually indicated as Mbps).
And wireless transfer speed is about half of the shown connection speed: a 800 mega bits per second connection results in about 400 mega bits per second data transfer = 50 mega bytes per second (given that the router can handle all data, often with multiple users and multiple data connections the individual transfer speeds are lower, and in case of Internet speed your ISP subscription must support it).

 

[ColinTaylor]

And wires transfer speed...

I believe you meant to say wireless.