Migrating/Upgrade From AX86U to AX86U Pro, Maintaining Settings Assumptions

[opensourcehw]

So I recently purchased an AX86U Pro and I have successfully installed the latest version of Merlin on it (3004.388.8_2). Now I want to set it up with the way my current AX86U is setup (nothing too fancy, no scripts or anything, just a bunch of old settings I tweaked years ago when I bought the router).

So my ignorant assumption is, can I just import/load the .CFG file from my AX86U into my AX86U Pro and everything should be just fine and dandy? I figured it shouldn't do anything too terrible, especially since the two models are quite similar. Anything I should take caution of before doing this? It shouldn't break anything...right?


Also, while I'm at it, on my older AX86U with Merlin(older firmware), I don't want to do a "dirty flash"(upgrading from current old state to the latest). So I was going to do a factory reset in the ASUS portal ( "Initialize all the settings, and clear all the data log for AiProtection, Traffic Analyzer, and Web History." ), before upgrading to the latest Merlin firmware. Really dumb question, but I wanted to validate my assumption, is this how you all do "clean" installs? Or is there a more thorough way to "factory reset" before installing the latest firmware?



edit: So @Justinh had advised that I do not restore the .CFG file from my AX86U to the AX86U Pro, so I believe him and I won't. However, once I get the AX86U updated, I plan on using the .CFG file to restore, any reservations on that(I can't imagine it would cause any issues as I'm using the same router, just different firmware)?

*edit#2: Regarding my question on doing a "clean install"/"factory reset" before jumping to a much more newer Merlin firmware, I believe the term I was looking for was "Hard reset", I've been away from tinkering for quite some time...:

So with that said, prior to upgrading to the latest, I should:

1.) Perform a Hard Reset (as per Asus's official instructions for performing a Hard Reset).
2.) After the Hard Reset has been performed successfully, proceed to upload the latest Merlin file,
3.) Manually reconfigure my settings

Did I get it right?





Thanks in advance.

(I'm still learning)

 

[Justinh]

So my ignorant assumption is, can I just import/load the .CFG file from my AX86U into my AX86U Pro

Do not do this. Capture your settings in the old router, then manually configure the new router.

Update the router firmware first thing.

 

[opensourcehw]

Do not do this. Capture your settings in the old router, then manually configure the new router.

Update the router firmware first thing.

I'm very glad I asked before proceeding. Is it because the routers are different models?

As for updating the router firmware, I have already done that with new one( AX86U Pro ), so now I just need to manually configure it page by page.

However, for the older AX86U I have, is my assumption correct for doing a "factory reset" before updating to the latest Merlin?

 

[bennor]

So my ignorant assumption is, can I just import/load the .CFG file from my AX86U into my AX86U Pro and everything should be just fine and dandy? I

If you search the site you'll find this question raised many times. Exporting one router model's settings via CFG and importing them into a different router model. The opinions are mixed. Some do so without issue, others have issues. Cannot find the exact discussion off hand but there was one specific discussion where this was heavily discussed and commented on with varied opinions. (edit to add see links below)

Most recommend not importing a different router's saved CFG. Importing a older CFG from a different router may work, or it may not. You have have issues crop up later that you'll spend time tracking down. Personally this is one of those few times where it's wise to spend a few extra minutes manually setting up and configuring the new router. Less chance of introducing possible issues.

can configuration information of the same firmware version be exported/imported to each other?

For example, I exported the 3004.388.7 configuration information in RT-AX58U and imported it directly into GT-AX6000 (of course the firmware of GT-AX6000 is also 3004.388.7). Is it possible to import the configuration directly like this? On the contrary, can I export the configuration of...

www.snbforums.com

Transferring the cfg file to another model

Hello, good morning, I have been using the ASUS RT-AX88U router with operating firmware Marlin 386_7_2 for a long time. But it's starting to wear out and I'd like to switch to a new piece before it collapses. The same model, when I looked, is no longer available for purchase. I assume its...

www.snbforums.com

 

[Tech9]

This works on stock Asuswrt only. Save/restore is Asuswrt tool unaware of all the changes in Asuswrt-Merlin.

 

[PunchCardBoss]

As an old-time DataBase designer, let me try to explain the issues of taking an old Asus settings file and using it on any [ANY] newer or different Firmware version.

In classic Database language, a "Table" is made up of "Records" (most often many). Each "Record" is made up of "Fields" (most often many).

Every Field has several parameters or characteristics. For example: length, alpha or numeric or both, type of numeric field (floating or integer), etc.

Now, looking at the contents of the Asus settings file with a viewing tool (e.g. https://github.com/medo64/WrtSettings), it is easy to see that it is an export or report of what is likely several tables. I'm not saying that Asus settings files are classic Db files. It is pretty clear they are not because some fields have have comma separated data. And I acknowledge that a router real-time OS is different than classic SQL systems. Nonetheless, data integrity is equally important in both kinds of systems.

What most of us don't know (the exception being folks like @RMerlin ) is whether the data tables in the router change in any way (e.g. number and characteristics of each field) from firmware version to firmware version. And we don't know (same disclaimer) if the script that imports a settings file made with one firmware version will modify data to accommodate data Record and Field changes in a different firmware version.

Without knowing the above, there is always a risk when importing an Asus setting file made from a different firmware version.

In general ....

• If you are importing an Asus settings file made with the identical firmware version, you are safe, even across different router models. But the chance that Asus has the same Firmware version on different router models is remote.
• If you are importing an Asus settings file within the same class of firmware (e.g. 384 or 388), there is risk - enough that your router may not function properly. The risk increases significantly across different router models.
  • ADDED: Try this. Use a tool like https://github.com/medo64/WrtSettings to view settings files. Compare the settings files from one Firmware version to another with Excel or Notebook++ (or similar tool). Chance are you will see a different number of records. I did this between 2 FW versions that were one after another and found a differences. It was then I decided to never use a settings file from an older FW version as import for a newer FW version.
• If you are importing an Asus settings file made with a different firmware class, there is considerable risk - perhaps bricking your router.

 

[Tech9]

Save/restore doesn’t work this way. Not a database copy/paste, has compatibility checks and does format conversions. Works well between different router models running different firmware. Again - stock Asuswrt only tool.

 

[opensourcehw]

As an old-time DataBase designer, let me try to explain the issues of taking an old Asus settings file and using it on any [ANY] newer or different Firmware version.

In classic Database language, a "Table" is made up of "Records" (most often many). Each "Record" is made up of "Fields" (most often many).

Every Field has several parameters or characteristics. For example: length, alpha or numeric or both, type of numeric field (floating or integer), etc.

Now, looking at the contents of the Asus settings file with a viewing tool (e.g. https://github.com/medo64/WrtSettings), it is easy to see that it is an export or report of what is likely several tables. I'm not saying that Asus settings files are classic Db files. It is pretty clear they are not because some fields have have comma separated data. And I acknowledge that a router real-time OS is different than classic SQL systems. Nonetheless, data integrity is equally important in both kinds of systems.

What most of don't know (the exception being folks like @RMerlin ) is whether the data tables in the router change in any way (e.g. number and characteristics of each field) from firmware version to firmware version. And we don't know (same disclaimer) if the script that imports a settings file made with one firmware will modify data to accommodate data Record and Field changes in a different firmware version.

Without knowing the above, there is always a risk when importing an Asus setting file made from a different firmware version.

In general ....

• If you are importing an Asus settings file made with the identical firmware version, you are safe, even across different router models. But the chance that Asus has the same Firmware version on different router models is remote.
• If you are importing an Asus settings file within the same class of firmware (e.g. 384 or 388), there is risk - enough that your router may not function properly. The risk increases significantly across different router models.
  • ADDED: Try this. Use a tool like https://github.com/medo64/WrtSettings to view settings files. Compare the settings files from one Firmware version to another with Excel or Notebook++ (or similar tool). Chance are you will see a different number of records. I did this one between 2 FW versions that were one after another and found a differences. It was then I decided to never use a settings file from an older FW version as import for a newer FW version.
• If you are importing an Asus settings file made with a different firmware class, there is considerable risk - perhaps bricking your router.

Thank you @PunchCardBoss for this explanation! It helped a lot, as someone who used to do regression testing and seeing how a system would handle out of parameter inputs, this makes much more clear.


Would you happen to know the answer to my question above regarding factory resets before installs?

"Also, while I'm at it, on my older AX86U with Merlin(older firmware), I don't want to do a "dirty flash"(upgrading from current old state to the latest). So I was going to do a factory reset in the ASUS portal ( "Initialize all the settings, and clear all the data log for AiProtection, Traffic Analyzer, and Web History." ), before upgrading to the latest Merlin firmware. Really dumb question, but I wanted to validate my assumption, is this how you all do "clean" installs? Or is there a more thorough way to "factory reset" before installing the latest firmware?"

-----

So after numerous searches for "factory reset" and "clean installs", I was looking for the term I had been searching for. What I was really looking for(at least I think) was "Hard Reset"!

https://www.snbforums.com/threads/factory-reset-whys-and-wherefores.88096/


It has been a while since I've done this stuff, so thanks to everyone for their patience.

 

[opensourcehw]

This works on stock Asuswrt only. Save/restore is Asuswrt tool unaware of all the changes in Asuswrt-Merlin.

Thanks, @Tech9 , I'll take your word for it, also your later response regarding the compatibility checks helped. Like @bennor had mentioned, there seemed to be a lot of mixed feelings about it, I had searched and the answer seemed somewhat inconclusive and unclear, hence my asking.

I had initially assumed that the restore .CFG files would've worked with Merlin, but I was mistaken from my ignorance. So thanks for the clarification. I'm glad I did not try to do a restore before checking with the community first.

 

[PunchCardBoss]

Save/restore doesn’t work this way. Not a database copy/paste, has compatibility checks and does format conversions. Works well between different router models running different firmware. Again - stock Asuswrt only tool.

I will conceded to @Tech9 as he knows better than I do.

Good to know there are compatability checks. Yet Asus doesn't have a particularly strong coding history. So I will continue to be cautious about importing settings files to different FW versions.

 

[PunchCardBoss]

is this how you all do "clean" installs? Or is there a more thorough way to "factory reset" before installing the latest firmware?"

Admittedly, there is some ambiguity on this subject. The terms "factory reset" and "hard reset" are tossed around without clarity.

Asus uses the terms "method 1" and "method 2" resets.

"Method 2" resets are the most robust as they remove all user settings and return the router to it's initial setup condition - with the current FW. In many cases (but not all) users in this form use the term "hard reset" to mean the same thing.

Asus has instructions on their website for "method 1" and "method 2" resets under the FAQ for each router. The instructions are not the same across Asus' router product line. So best to check your router model at asus.com.

 

[ColinTaylor]

"Method 2" resets are the most robust as they remove all user settings and return the router to it's initial setup condition - with the current FW. In many cases (but not all) users in this form use the term "hard reset" to mean the same thing.

This is incorrect/misleading as I pointed out when you said this recently: https://www.snbforums.com/threads/hacker-has-remote-control-over-my-devices.92102/post-928538

 

[PunchCardBoss]

This is incorrect/misleading as I pointed out when you said this recently:

Ahhhh. Tks @ColinTaylor . Appreciate your clarification and differentiation between AC and AX routers. Your explanation does explain why I have seen different methods refering to "hard factory resets" My bad. Smarter now.

 

[ColinTaylor]

Appreciate your clarification and differentiation between AC and AX routers.

To be clear, the "method" is not a differentiation between AC and AX routers. There are currently two different standard reset methods and eight different hard reset methods. To determine which hard factory reset method to use for a particular model you should refer to the table in the FAQ.

 

[opensourcehw]

Thanks @PunchCardBoss and @ColinTaylor (especially for linking the thread). So it's the "Hard Factory Reset" term that I was looking for!

 

[PunchCardBoss]

compatibility checks and does format conversions

I understand the function of translation/format conversion and mapping scripting.

@Tech9 do you know how many FW version hops Asus translation scripts & mapping support? And would FW downgrading be supported?

(Just curious)

 

[Tech9]

I will conceded to @Tech9 as he knows better than I do.

I don't know the inner workings, but this is what it does in real life:

can configuration information of the same firmware version be exported/imported to each other?

If you overwrite these nvrams with the MAC of a different device's config file, they won't be replaced by the correct one unless you did another factory default reset. You will end up with a mixture of correct and incorrect MACs. On which mac addresses do you refer to? This is the AX88U I...

www.snbforums.com

There is no official the same firmware and the same router requirement. I would say it works pretty well most of the time. If something goes wrong there is always a reset option. In my tests everything went smoothly resulting in up and running new hardware in minutes. There were reports of successfully migrated settings between routers not included in my tests up to AX Pro models. About BE and 3006 firmware - to be confirmed.

And some additional observations:

can configuration information of the same firmware version be exported/imported to each other?

If you overwrite these nvrams with the MAC of a different device's config file, they won't be replaced by the correct one unless you did another factory default reset. You will end up with a mixture of correct and incorrect MACs. On which mac addresses do you refer to? This is the AX88U I...

www.snbforums.com

 

[Tech9]

I had initially assumed that the restore .CFG files would've worked with Merlin

It does work, but better used for same firmware on the same hardware. There are too many custom configurations possible beyond what's available in stock Asuswrt. As far as I understand this tool was adapted to Asuswrt-Merlin, but comes with limitations.

And would FW downgrading be supported?

This depends on what's changed in the new firmware. For Asuswrt there is a term "minimum required" firmware and it can't be downgraded. Asus can push updates even to routers with Auto Upgrade option disabled if a new version of firmware becomes "minimum required".

 

[Squall Leonhart]

This works on stock Asuswrt only. Save/restore is Asuswrt tool unaware of all the changes in Asuswrt-Merlin.

works fine on merlin.

 

[Tech9]

works fine on merlin.

No, it doesn't. Try save restore from early 386 to late 388 Asuswrt-Merlin firmware and on different hardware.