MoCA 2.5 adapters?

[Samir]

I agree 2.5GbE ethernet port is much better.
Let us do a detailed discussion. I will explain why we don't select 2.5GbE ethernet port.
First, MoCA 2.5 can provided 2.5Gbps real traffic bandwidth over the media. for MoCA, the maximum devices are 16, all the devices share the 2.5Gbps. For example, if you have two adapters connected to PC A and B. A and B do transmission at the same time, you use 1Gbps(A to B) and 1Gbps(B to A). Total 2Gbps bandwidth is used, very near to the 2.5Gbps. If you have 3 adapters, definitely, you can use all the 2.5Gbps bandwidth over MoCA. So from a practical point of view, 1GbE ethernet port is enough.
If we upgrade to 2.5GbE port, the cost will increase about $3 each device. We don't want the customer to take the rising cost.
In the future, the MoCA3.0 will support up to 10Gbps, we will upgrade the ethernet port 2.5G/5G/10GbE. That will be much reasonable.
Hope this can give you more clear answer.
Thanks.

Thank you very much for the detailed discussion. I agree that with a multi-point moca 2.5 network, the 1Gbe port is more than enough.

However, there is a market for ethernet extenders that work over coax such as these:
https://www.netsys-direct.com/colle...erxtender-hcna-ethernet-over-coax-nh-310cekit
https://www.startech.com/Networking...l-Unmanaged-Network-Extender-Kit-2km~EOC1110K
https://ethernetextender.com/product/enable-it-821c-coax-ethernet-extender/

And while this isn't the target market for moca products, they can do very well in these applications, most of the time exceeding bandwidth requirements for short runs.

But since in an ethernet extender capacity moca is typically being used to bridge two points, maximum bandwidth becomes a priority. Hence, for the relatively minor increase in cost (I would pay $10 extra), in a point to point capacity, the gocoax product would literally have no rival. Maybe a niche market from a business standpoint, but something to consider since the prices for competing products are at least 2x the cost of the gocoax product.

It's great to hear something about moca3.0, but it doesn't seem we will see this very soon. And I think in the meantime with realtek unifying their 2.5/1G drivers, there will soon be a flood of 2.5G nic chipsets available at the same price as 1G starting the transition from 1G to 2.5G on a larger scale. Hopefully, this will make the decision easy on whether to include a 2.5Gbe port as the $3 difference will be eliminated.

Thank you again for forging ahead with a moca 2.5 product available to consumers. The applications for this technology are vast, and as demand shows, your product is highly sought after because of this.

 

[Samir]

Hello Trip, Thanks for your input.
In fact, we have studied this for a while. found it is impossible for MoCA. their products are for Point to Point scenario. There is no splitter in the coaxial network. Splitter will block the power transmission. So we have to use dedicated power adapter for each MoCA adapter.
For your case, I think maybe MoCA access is an option, or you just use the planet solution.
You can check MoCA access via the following link.
http://www.mocalliance.org/access/index.htm

Moca access sounds great. The only problem is that we are stuck only in 2016 since there is only 1 moca 2.5 adapter in the market. I'm actually shocked that this timeline is still up on the official moca alliance site.

 

[krkaufman]

Correct, MoCA 2.5 only increase the channels numbers than MoCA 2.0.
There is a mode in MoCA 2.0 called Turbo mode, which exists when there are only two MoCA devices present. When this is recognized, some of the overhead transactions are removed thereby giving a 12% increase in PHY rate.
But for MoCA 2.5, there is no such mode.

But if your adapters are achieving 500 Mbps per channel, then you’re already hitting 2.0 “TURBO” throughput levels, so MoCA 2.5 must be doing something more than just bonding additional channels.

 

[gocoax]

Moca access sounds great. The only problem is that we are stuck only in 2016 since there is only 1 moca 2.5 adapter in the market. I'm actually shocked that this timeline is still up on the official moca alliance site.

Just now, only MaxLinear can provide MoCA 2.5 chips. And also looks like this is a niche market, no other vendor wants to develop such chips.
I think this is the reason for slow progress.

 

[gocoax]

But if your adapters are achieving 500 Mbps per channel, then you’re already hitting 2.0 “TURBO” throughput levels, so MoCA 2.5 must be doing something more than just bonding additional channels.

Will study and give you an update. Thanks

 

[Samir]

Just now, only MaxLinear can provide MoCA 2.5 chips. And also looks like this is a niche market, no other vendor wants to develop such chips.
I think this is the reason for slow progress.

That explains a lot as it is hard to develop for a niche market. One of the reasons why the adaptation of 2.5Gbe/5Gbe has been so slow.

 

[gocoax]

That explains a lot as it is hard to develop for a niche market. One of the reasons why the adaptation of 2.5Gbe/5Gbe has been so slow.

2.5GbE/5GbE is in the very early stage of market. The price is too high. 2.5GbE PHY is more than $3.x, 5GbE PHY is about $5-$6. Far more higher than GbE PHY. It is about $0.6.
We still need to wait for some time to see more 2.5GbE/5GbE products.

 

[Samir]

2.5GbE/5GbE is in the very early stage of market. The price is too high. 2.5GbE PHY is more than $3.x, 5GbE PHY is about $5-$6. Far more higher than GbE PHY. It is about $0.6.
We still need to wait for some time to see more 2.5GbE/5GbE products.

Thank you very much for the details! This very much explains why the products are not there yet--5x to 10x more for the component is a huge jump in price. Hopefully economies of scale will bring these prices down to 2x-4x soon. Then maybe there would be a chance of seeing at least 2.5GbE becoming commonplace.

 

[Vito]

Hi there,
So, I received my MoCA adapters from goCoax. Thanks Jet (the guy from goCoax) fro your prompt feedback and efforts to arrange the adapters for me!
Yesterday I pick up them from the local post office and, sure, immediately make the test connection. I have the plan from my Internet provider D500/U1000.
How I connect: Internet ----- home router ---goCoax--------goCoax----- gigabyte switch ------ Apple TV 4K with SpeedTest installed . The SpeedTest on Apple TV shown D431/U909.
Then, I swap goCoax adapter to Ethernet cable and got D786/U912.
So, the download speed have big difference between the results. However, goCoax made good products and I like it.

 

[Samir]

Thank you for the picture! I've always wondered what these looked like in real life.

Are you sure your download isn't 1000 and upload 500? Usually asymmetrical speeds favor download versus upload. In fact if you're getting D768/U912 surely you have a 1G symmetrical plan?

As far as the difference between the gocoax versus ethernet cable, I would expect it to hit the full bandwidth that you can over a direct cable. If you have a piece of cable wire that is not in the wall, I would try again using that cable and see what you get. Perhaps the wire in the wall isn't the best or has something going on with it.

 

[Vito]

Thank you for the picture! I've always wondered what these looked like in real life.

Are you sure your download isn't 1000 and upload 500? Usually asymmetrical speeds favor download versus upload. In fact if you're getting D768/U912 surely you have a 1G symmetrical plan?

As far as the difference between the gocoax versus ethernet cable, I would expect it to hit the full bandwidth that you can over a direct cable. If you have a piece of cable wire that is not in the wall, I would try again using that cable and see what you get. Perhaps the wire in the wall isn't the best or has something going on with it.

Hi Samir,
Well, my plan is D500/U1000, but time-to-time I get the higher download speed, as it was during the testing. I will try to connects adapter via piece of coax cable and measure the speed, but the coax cable in the wall doesn't connect to any cable or sat services.

 

[Samir]

Hi Samir,
Well, my plan is D500/U1000, but time-to-time I get the higher download speed, as it was during the testing. I will try to connects adapter via piece of coax cable and measure the speed, but the coax cable in the wall doesn't connect to any cable or sat services.

For someone like me who needs more upload bandwidth than download, I would love your plan!

If your Internet speed spikes higher on the download, that would not be the best test. The best test would be to simply have a computer on each end and use iperf to test the bandwidth between them--that's a pretty solid test. If you get gigabit speeds via this test, you're in good shape. Otherwise, I would try a separate cable from what is in the wall. Many times cable in the wall is rg59 vs rg6, so it might not work as well. Also, the age of the cable makes a difference as well considering what it might have been through over the years.

 

[sch9171]

Anyone have a few of these they're not using and looking to sell? @zoomlenz did you ever sell yours?

I need some for my network in a new house, and I'm too impatient to wait for them to come back in stock.

 

[zoomlenz]

Anyone have a few of these they're not using and looking to sell? @zoomlenz did you ever sell yours?

I need some for my network in a new house, and I'm too impatient to wait for them to come back in stock.

Mine have been rehomed.

 

[flyoffacliff]

Just an FYI, there are some other companies with MOCA 2.5 adapters now. inxtnd.com built on top of the MOCA standard and increased the number of devices to over 100 for enterprise use. But they only sell to dealers and stuff, which probably means $$$.

Teamly Digital (https://www.teamly-digital.com/tdnm250/), also sells a MOCA 2.5 adapter with a 2.5Gbe port! I inquired with them and they said they are only selling to distributors now, but plan to begin selling them on on Amazon around the end of February 2020! So, depending on price, I think Gocoax could see some competition!

 

[TRANSLITE GLOBAL]

Traslite Global has the MoCA2.5 adapters available in stock. TL-MC84. If you would like to purchase it directly, you can email sales@transliteglobal.com or purchase through Amazon as well. Usually direct emails when referred through SNB forums fetches clients an extra discount.

Thanks,
Translite Team