MOCA on 8 Coax Lines

[PuckHead]

I have purchased a PPC 9M-UU powered MOCA splitter. My objective is to use a MOCA adapter to enable ethernet at 8 separate COAX connection locations. My current set-up along with the new splitter is:

1. one COAX line from the ISP which provides cable/internet (Spectrum)
2. eight open COAX cables inside, which go to 8 locations in our home
3. Cable Modem without MOCA capabilities
4. Two Actiontec MOCA adapter/modems.

I want to learn what is the correct configuration, using the PPC Splitter, that will enable strong MOCA connectivity at each of the 8 COAX locations (I am aware that I will need to purchase 7 more MOCA adapters for use at the 8 locations). My questions are:

• 1. Is the splitter connected to the COAX line from the ISP? (yes or no)
• 2. Is the modem connected to the splitter? If so, what port on the splitter is it connected?
• 3. Is the MOCA adapter connected to an OUT port on the splitter by Coax and to the modem LAN by Cat 5e or 6?
• 4. Are the eight COAX cables connected to the OUT ports of the splitter?
• 5. Will this configuration in total enable MOCA connectivity over the eight cables?
• 6. Should I split the signal from the ISP, before connecting into the new splitter, if yes, how is that done and why is that done?

 

[krkaufman]

Some preliminary questions...

1. By "modem" do you mean combo modem/router? (Can you provide the model #?)

2. Is your central junction location (where your 8 cables + incoming line meet) inside or outdoors?

3. If indoors, does the modem/router need to be located in one of your remote rooms, or can it be installed at the central panel location?

4. If you want the modem/router in a remote room, does this room have only a single coax line from the central junction available? Or two?

5. Do you have any devices that require the raw cable signal other than the cable modem?

 

[krkaufman]

6. Should I split the signal from the ISP, before connecting into the new splitter, if yes, how is that done and why is that done?

The answer to this question (and the others) depends on the answers to the prelim questions, above.

But for background, the "designed for MoCA" amp that you have (PPC-9M-U/U) has a built-in "PoE" MoCA filter, so MoCA signals cannot pass between the amplifier's input and output ports ... only between its output ports. Therefore, were you to split the signal to the modem prior to the amplifier, the main MoCA/Ethernet bridge would need to be connected to one of the amplifier's output ports via a separate coax line. (So it's possible, and can be preferable as DOCSIS 3.1 migration expands, but would require an additional coax line, isolating the modem from the MoCA-infused coax lines.)

Of course, if you can split the modem signal off prior to the amplifier, the need for the amplifier is then questionable, since it only amplifies signals in the 5-1002 MHz range. (Thus the question regarding whether you need the raw cable signal for any device other than the modem.)

 

[PuckHead]

Some preliminary questions...

1. By "modem" do you mean combo modem/router? (Can you provide the model #?)

1 - Will be a modem only with a separate router. Spectrum has not visited my new home yet. Likely to be a docsis 3.1 HiTron E312V1 modem given contract speed will be 400 mpbs. Prefer I set the MOCA up as a 3.1 with a separate router, given a likely change later if they find a way to give me a 3.0 to start. Will a 3.1 MOCA config work with a 3.0 modem? Finally, Let’s pleaecassume also that the modem does not have MoCa. Because I may prefer to enable MOCA with the adapter rather than with the modem.

2. Is your central junction location (where your 8 cables + incoming line meet) inside or outdoors?

indoors. I am assuming I will replace that junction with my powered amp junction; correct?

3. If indoors, does the modem/router need to be located in one of your remote rooms, or can it be installed at the central panel location?

3 - at central panel; prefer both the modem and the router be at the central panrl

4. If you want the modem/router in a remote room, does this room have only a single coax line from the central junction available? Or two?

4 - N/a

5. Do you have any devices that require the raw cable signal other than the cable modem?

Would like to retain that option in one CoAX location of our home. However, priority is internet / LAN connectivity through cable, given that all our TVs are on FireSticks

 

[PuckHead]

I have added my answers to your excellent questions. Many thanks.

 

[krkaufman]

2 - indoors
3 - at central panel; prefer both the modem and the router be at the central panrl

Indoors and installing the modem/router at the central panel is most beneficial.

I'd recommend doing as you suggested, and split the incoming cable signal using a passive 2-way cable splitter, with one output running to the cable modem and the other to the amplifier's input port. This isolates the modem from your MoCA network, beneficial for DOCSIS 3.1 setups.

Then, given that the PPC-9M-U/U amp supposedly supports MoCA across all output ports (passive and amplified), you should then be able to connect your lines as follows to support 8 MoCA-networked locations ...

• Passive (voice) Out: main MoCA adapter at central panel (w/ MoCA adapter's Ethernet port connected to router LAN port)
• Out 1-8: lines to remote rooms

Any open coax ports should be capped w/ a 75-ohm terminator. No separate "PoE" MoCA filter should be needed, as the amplifier has one built-in.


p.s. Alternatively... If you had no need for cable signals at any of the remote room locations, you could do a simple direct-connect of the incoming cable signal to the modem (no 2-way split), and then use a passive MoCA 2.0-compatible 8-way splitter (e.g.) in place of the powered amplifier, with the main MoCA adapter connected to this 8-way splitter's input port. Similar to the following...

​

 

[degrub]

If you allow doccis 3.1 across the same coax as the moca2 or 2.5 modems, you will likely have to shift the moca system to the D high band and give up one of the 5 sub bands that moca2 or 2,5 can use. For moca2.5, this means slightly less than full gigabit rate full duplex.
In a practical sense, it may not matter for nominal home usage cases.

in your setup with 8 moca modems sharing the available total bandwidth, it may matter at peak simultaneous demand as you would see lower individual throughput or some added latency.

i would use moca 2.5 with that many modems unless the bandwidth required by each is modest.

 

[krkaufman]

If you allow doccis 3.1 across the same coax as the moca2 or 2.5 modems, you will likely have to shift the moca system to the D high band and give up one of the 5 sub bands that moca2 or 2,5 can use.

Fortunately, the OP will be able to isolate the modem's coax line from the MoCA segment, so DOCSIS 3.1 and MoCA overlap won't be an issue.

That said, configuring a MoCA 2.0/2.5 adapter for D-High leaves 2 channels behind. This isn't a limitation for bonded MoCA 2.0, with a max of 2 bonded channels, but would limit max shared bandwidth in a multi-node MoCA 2.5 setup configured for D-High to 1200 Mbps (rather than 2000 Mbps).

Per the MoCA spec (PDF):

The MoCA 2.0 frequency plan defines, within the new extended band D, two sub-bands for independent network operation. These sub-bands comprise the D-low and D-high, as follows:​

• Sub-band D-Low (DL): 1125 to 1225 MHz edge to edge (100 MHz wide)
• Sub-band D-High (DH): 1350 to 1675 MHz edge to edge (325 MHz wide)
• Guard-band between sub-bands: 1225 to 1350 MHz (125 MHz wide)

 

[PuckHead]

Awesome help. Particularly because I will be doing this config during a move to a new home, with no anticipated mercy from my so beloved ones if I mess this up. DrK and degrub, your instructions are clear.

 

[PuckHead]

Awesome help. Particularly because I will be doing this config during a move to a new home, with no anticipated mercy from my so beloved ones if I mess this up. DrK and degrub, your instructions are clear.

 

[krkaufman]

Wireless coverage may be the only concern, depending on the location of the central panel. Having wired MoCA connections throughout the house should allow for optimal placement of additional wireless access points or mesh satellites, as needed.

 

[PuckHead]

Agree. Yes; I have two access points planned in the same config. Better than extenders.

 

[PuckHead]

Agree. Yes; I have two access points planned in the same config. Better than extenders.

 

[degrub]

What does the house floor plan look like and where do you plan to place the APs ?

 

[PuckHead]

AP placement should be easy. APs will be placed in center of my home (an office) and towards end of my home that is opposite to where the PoE is located. Both locations have coax. I found that two were needed in a similar size home.

 

[PuckHead]

Indoors and installing the modem/router at the central panel is most beneficial.

I'd recommend doing as you suggested, and split the incoming cable signal using a passive 2-way cable splitter, with one output running to the cable modem and the other to the amplifier's input port. This isolates the modem from your MoCA network, beneficial for DOCSIS 3.1 setups.

Then, given that the PPC-9M-U/U amp supposedly supports MoCA across all output ports (passive and amplified), you should then be able to connect your lines as follows to support 8 MoCA-networked locations ...

• Passive (voice) Out: main MoCA adapter at central panel (w/ MoCA adapter's Ethernet port connected to router LAN port)
• Out 1-8: lines to remote rooms

Any open coax ports should be capped w/ a 75-ohm terminator. No separate "PoE" MoCA filter should be needed, as the amplifier has one built-in.


p.s. Alternatively... If you had no need for cable signals at any of the remote room locations, you could do a simple direct-connect of the incoming cable signal to the modem (no 2-way split), and then use a passive MoCA 2.0-compatible 8-way splitter (e.g.) in place of the powered amplifier, with the main MoCA adapter connected to this 8-way splitter's input port. Similar to the following...

View attachment 27980​

AP placement should be easy. APs will be placed in center of my home (an office) and towards end of my home that is opposite to where the PoE is located. Both locations have coax. I found that two were needed in a similar size home.

 

[PuckHead]

krkaufman - i have one question after reading this very helpful stream again

For moca configs that do not require TV cable (just internet) you indicated that I could do a direct-connect of the incoming cable signal to the modem (no 2-way split), and then use a passive MoCA 2.0-compatible 8-way splitter (e.g.) in place of the powered amplifier

My question is: could I use the powered moca compatible splitter that I already have in place of the passive version?

 

[krkaufman]

krkaufman - i have one question after reading this very helpful stream again

For moca configs that do not require TV cable (just internet) you indicated that I could do a direct-connect of the incoming cable signal to the modem (no 2-way split), and then use a passive MoCA 2.0-compatible 8-way splitter (e.g.) in place of the powered amplifier

My question is: could I use the powered moca compatible splitter that I already have in place of the passive version?

You could, I suppose*, but not in the same way, in that you couldn't feed the main bridging MoCA adapter via the amplifier's input port, owing to the amp's built-in "PoE" MoCA filter (which would block MoCA signals from passing through the input port). You'd need to wire-up the amplifier the same as originally described (in this post), and cap the amp's input w/ a 75-ohm terminator.

* I don't know if there are any concerns/issues with running an amplifier in this way, with the input terminated. That said, since you wouldn't be amplifying any signal, you could also experiment with having the amplifier's power off, seeing if there is any effect on the MoCA stats or effective network throughput.