N66U Finally Getting Upgraded!

[billyk]

I've had my N66U since the early days of that product, paired with an old SurfBoard modem. With a 300mbs line, I get about 200mbs on 5mgh within 6 feet, average is probably 80-100mbs on most of level above the basement and maybe 50mgh on the top level, falling off to 0mbs at the other end of the house.

I just purchased the SB8200 and I am struggling with router selection. I've done my diligence reading the copious amount of posts here on the subject of router upgrades, and I really appreciate the wealth of information you folks have provided. Still, I am not 100% sure yet of my next purchase. Here is my situation:

- 300mbs connection via Xfinity/Comcast, may bump up to next tier
- New SB8200 modem
- 3000+ sq ft home, 3 levels
- Router placement is restricted to the first level, one end of the house, partly underground
- 3 Rokus, XBox, 6 laptops, 1 desktop, 6 cellphones, 2 Kindles, some other devices as well
- Rural area, no need to deal with signal congestion
- Don't upgrade network gear often (obiviously!), would like to continue that
- Although I have only one Wifi 6 device, I am looking to future proof a bit
- Looking to spend $150, but can go higher if there is a good reason to do so
- I am hoping to be able to use more of my 300mbs speed, and to get that signal throughout my house

After research here, I am led to think that the Netgear 7800 is still a top choice, although the hardware is aging and the software updates are rare. The RT-AC86U rises to the top as well, but there are those troublesome reviews regarding lack of reliability. I've also looked at the C2300 at low end and the AX88U at the other end. Also researched mesh, almost pulling the trigger on the Google Wifi, but I am not convinced that I will get optimal speeds, especially if I bump to higher tiers over time.

Any help would be greatly appreciated!
-bk

 

[ColinTaylor]

- Looking to spend $150, but can go higher if there is a good reason to do so

That would appear to be below the price of all the devices you've quoted (according to amazon.com), even taking into account the usual discounts.

 

[kernol]

You will have to at least DOUBLE your budget of $150 to find any router cable of WiFi 6 [your future proof quest].
If you can stretch that far - then follow RMerlin [and many others on this Merlin-Ware forum] and get an Asus RT-AX88U.

Neither the Netgear 7800 nor the RT-AC86U have WiFi 6 capabilities.
I have an RT-AC86U and have not had any issues running Merlin-Ware. Best router I own by far.

 

[billyk]

Thanks guys!

I can get the AC86U new on eBay for about $140 and the Netgear 7800 is the same price point.

There seems to be so much support for buying the AC86U here on this forum. I may just wait for Wifi6 to become more affordable and pick up an AC86U now. I am sure it'll be an improvement over the N66U!

 

[Trip]

Regarding AX, it's respectable to try and make your setup future-friendly (no such thing as "future proof"), but we're still pre-draft-1 and IMHO not worth buying the hardware until well past ratification, when stuff like OFDMA is actually enabled and working on the bulk of client/APs. Until then, it's just overspend on hardware that may not be patched in a year or two's time, and no real-world gain now. Moral: AC Wave 2 is fine, even for as rarely as you upgrade.

That settled, it sounds as though you may really benefit from a second (or even third) radio location, instead of trying to blast signal (and noise) from a single cell. Do you have ethernet throughout the house? If so, most any whole-house system that supports wired backhaul should do a better job at delivering usable bandwidth at the far ends of the house. If you don't have ethernet but do have coaxial, I'd suggest MoCa 2.5/2.0, if not for the fact that the adapters would exhaust most of your budget on their own. So if you can't create a wired backbone at all, then you might consider a tri-band whole-house product like Orbi or Deco M9. The dedicated 5Ghz backhaul links will allow for dual-band directly available to clients, theoretically ensuring higher speed overall versus dual-band systems like Google Wifi or Eero.

If you really wanted to stick with an all-in-one, I would highly encourage Qualcomm (R7800 or the identical Zyxel NBG6817), as it's going to provide 10-20% more usable throughput at range than roughly-equivalent Broadcom (86U, etc.). I'd actually favor the Zyxel because ironically enough I think they've nailed their factory firmware stability better than Netgear. Otherwise, OpenWRT is available for both.

Hope some of that helps!

 

[billyk]

Regarding AX, it's respectable to try and make your setup future-friendly (no such thing as "future proof"), but we're still pre-draft-1 and IMHO not worth buying the hardware until well past ratification, when stuff like OFDMA is actually enabled and working on the bulk of client/APs. Until then, it's just overspend on hardware that may not be patched in a year or two's time, and no real-world gain now. Moral: AC Wave 2 is fine, even for as rarely as you upgrade.

That settled, it sounds as though you may really benefit from a second (or even third) radio location, instead of trying to blast signal (and noise) from a single cell. Do you have ethernet throughout the house? If so, most any whole-house system that supports wired backhaul should do a better job at delivering usable bandwidth at the far ends of the house. If you don't have ethernet but do have coaxial, I'd suggest MoCa 2.5/2.0, if not for the fact that the adapters would exhaust most of your budget on their own. So if you can't create a wired backbone at all, then you might consider a tri-band whole-house product like Orbi or Deco M9. The dedicated 5Ghz backhaul links will allow for dual-band directly available to clients, theoretically ensuring higher speed overall versus dual-band systems like Google Wifi or Eero.

If you really wanted to stick with an all-in-one, I would highly encourage Qualcomm (R7800 or the identical Zyxel NBG6817), as it's going to provide 10-20% more usable throughput at range than roughly-equivalent Broadcom (86U, etc.). I'd actually favor the Zyxel because ironically enough I think they've nailed their factory firmware stability better than Netgear. Otherwise, OpenWRT is available for both.

Hope some of that helps!

Thanks Trip for that excellent advice. The 7800 is still neck/neck with the AC86U for me.
Have a wonderful Holiday!
-bk

 

[Val D.]

The 7800 is still neck/neck with the AC86U for me.

I do not recommend getting RT-AC86U due to not enough RAM to run combinations of available firmware options and still unsolved soft reboot issue. For me this is a high maintenance router you have to monitor from time to time to ensure optimum performance.

 

[billyk]

Val D: I did some research but did not find anything on the soft reboot issue. Also, I intend to run the stock firmware.

Any additional insights are certainly welcome.
Thanks!

 

[Val D.]

Any additional insights are certainly welcome.

There is a long discussion about the soft reboot issue here on SNB:
https://www.snbforums.com/threads/ac86u-sometimes-powers-completely-off-during-reboot.48296/
Unfortunately, no solution has been found and it happens on every firmware, both Asuswrt and Asuswrt-Merlin.

In summary, sometimes the router just turns off during soft reboot and never comes back. It may happen on your first day of ownership, or in 2 months time. Random intermittent hard to diagnose issue, perhaps hardware related. If you choose RT-AC86U, do not use reboot scheduler and do not attempt remote reboots. You may need a physical access to the router to press the power button OFF and ON again in order to boot the router. Insufficient RAM for not yet fully optimized software running on this hardware platform may require rooter reboots from time to time in order to keep the router running properly, so you must be around.

If you go with ASUS, better get RT-AX88U model. Not because of AX support, but because it's a better hardware and users report much less issues with it. It has 1024MB RAM (vs 512MB), Quad-Core CPU (vs Dual-Core), 8 x LAN ports (vs 4 x LAN) + Asuswrt-Merlin support.

 

[billyk]

Thanks again Val. I have been looking at the 88U. Maybe I'll get lucky and there will be an after X'mas online sale somewhere!

 

[Val D.]

Thanks again Val. I have been looking at the 88U.

If you need 100 firmware options, fast VPN support on the router, AX support, etc. go with RT-AX88U. If AC is good enough and you need something to work well with no intentions to tinker with it, get the Netgear R7800. Both routers have similar excellent WiFi coverage and throughput. Keep in mind though a single AIO router, even the best models available, may not be able to cover your 3000+ sqf 3 floors house. You have to experiment. If RT-AX88U and R7800 can't do the job, then more APs are needed.

 

[billyk]

Thanks again!

 

[Deleted member 22229]

Thanks again!

Keep in mind that Netgear firmware is complete garbage and has broken more then it fixes on almost every model router they have. The last year and a half has been real bad. Also Netgear has only been releasing updates to the 7800 at about once a year at this point excluding one beta version. The latest .68 witch has not even hit there support server yet only addresses a AP mode fix and nothing more. One user said it also broke some functions in IPv6 so be aware.

 

[billyk]

Thanks again guys.
Great info!

 

[Val D.]

and has broken more then it fixes

Isn't it the same with Asuswrt?
I wish I kept RT-AC68U and run it on 380.xx, John's or Tomato without all the 3-rd party "improvements".
I'm tired of testing firmwares already, RT-AC86U is the worst ASUS product I ever owned, and the last one.

 

[Deleted member 22229]

Isn't it the same with Asuswrt?
I wish I kept RT-AC68U and run it on 380.xx, John's or Tomato without all the 3-rd party "improvements".
I'm tired of testing firmwares already, RT-AC86U is the worst ASUS product I ever owned, and the last one.

True. But Netgear has taken crap firmware to a new level. And yes they all have issues of some kind. I would never bother with the 86 or the AX88 after what I have read and heard on various forums and reviews. Quality control is not present. I am not buying anything until things mature. I am using the AX58 but I did not pay for it so it was a freebe from my employment.

And yes it boggles the mind at people that just keep flashing firmware after firmware constantly do they not care or need a solid running network. I do. But hey let them be the beta testers.

 

[Val D.]

And yes it boggles the mind at people that just keep flashing firmware after firmware constantly

The never ending hope things are right this time, followed quickly by the next disappointment.

 

[Poseidon]

Keep in mind that Netgear firmware is complete garbage and has broken more then it fixes on almost every model router they have. The last year and a half has been real bad. Also Netgear has only been releasing updates to the 7800 at about once a year at this point excluding one beta version. The latest .68 witch has not even hit there support server yet only addresses a AP mode fix and nothing more. One user said it also broke some functions in IPv6 so be aware.

I’ve been using the R7800 with the latest stock firmware (.63) for almost 4 months now and no issues whatsoever. Not a single reboot or hiccup. Wireless performance and stability is beastly!

Unfortunately couldn’t say the same when I previously owned the 86U. Constant slowdowns, reboots, buffering, etc. And really got sick and tired of playing the firmware download game every week or so?

How can something that’s supposed to be so elite possibly require an update so often? Done with Asus routers. Since the N66U - they’ve jumped the shark.

 

[Val D.]

And really got sick and tired of playing the firmware download

I played this game for two years and after Asuswrt 81351 just decided to remove RT-AC86U from my network.