New RT-AX86U Pair, slow speed when connected to wireless over aimesh, fast when connected to wired over aimesh

[Moejacky]

Hi, I've been lurking for some time and would appreciate some help. I recently replaced a Netgear R7000/EAX20 combo with 2 RT-AX86U

My family room has 1GB internet connected to RT-AX86U
I have another RT-AX86U connected in my office on the other side of the house.

From my office:
Wireless to RT-AX86U-FamilyRoom: 284mbps
Wireless to RT-AX86U-Office: 215mbps
Wired to RT-AX86U-Office: 530mbps (no ethernet backhaul, only aimesh)

I'm confused as heck as to why I'm getting better wireless to the Family Room router that's on the other side of the house vs being right next to the Office router.
And why is my speed double when I'm wired to the same office router?

I'm using a 2019 MacBook pro as the client.

Running the latest merlin on both nodes 386.4 (1-Jan-2022)

 

[Scoty]

I have very similar setup (MBP 2019 as client) and almost the same problem. The speed almost halves even when super close the the node (2nd router who should just increase the signal strength). If a stop it and use just my main router (the one wired to Internet) my speed is better...

 

[leerees]

You need to use 160mhz channels. This will ensure there is enough bandwidth for the backhaul traffic and clients.

 

[Tech9]

This will prevent incompatibility issues with older devices.

What incompatibility issues?

 

[leerees]

What incompatibility issues?

Sonos speakers, ring door bells, nest thermostats.

 

[Tech9]

Most are 2.4GHz devices. You don't need to use AX only for 5GHz band, cutting off all AC capable clients.
(what was your suggestion before you edited the post above)

 

[Tech9]

I'm confused as heck as to why I'm getting better wireless to the Family Room

Because your office router is a wireless repeater and one single radio serves both your clients and the wireless backhaul.

 

[leerees]

Most are 2.4GHz devices. You don't need to use AX only for 5GHz band, cutting off all AC capable clients.
(what was your suggestion before you edited the post above)

My suggestion was to set the 2.4ghz band to wireless N and to make the 5ghz band AX only. It stops older devices disconnecting from the mesh.

You want AX devices and the band to take full advantage of AX features such as OFDMA, higher QAM modulation and TWT. This will help the battery life of modern devices such as phones. Having AC devices on the band slows it down to AC speeds, which is about 15 - 20% less.

If you have no AX devices, then obviously let AC devices access the band.

 

[Tech9]

You want AX devices and the band to take full advantage of AX features

Your few AX devices mostly in form of phones will use your new AX router, the rest will be cramped in 802.11n from 2009 on crowded 2.4GHz band. All AC capable devices with throughput up to 500Mbps will get up to 50Mbps, if lucky. This is a very good advice indeed.

Having AC devices on the band slows it down to AC speeds

Incorrect. Wrong assumptions lead to wrong advice. I can show you max AX performance to AX client with N devices attached to the same 5GHz radio.

 

[leerees]

Right. Your few AX devices mostly in form of phones will use your new AX router, the rest will be cramped in 802.11n from 2009 on crowded 2.4GHz band. All AC capable devices with throughput up to 500Mbps will get up to 50Mbps, if lucky. This is a very good advice indeed.



This is not true.

I ran multiple speed tests at different nodes and setting "AX only" improved throughout on AX devices. My conclusion based on that test is having (or at least supporting) AC devices on the AX band slows it down to AC speeds.

Of course, you could just buy AX92u's, that way AC devices would have their own dedicated band anyway

 

[Tech9]

If you have no AX devices, then obviously let AC devices access the band.

What if you have 4x newer AX devices and 20x older AC devices? Very common scenario. Still reserve the 5GHz band for 4x AX devices only?

AC devices on the AX band slows it down to AC speeds.

Once again, this is incorrect. If that happens on AX92U, this is another reason to avoid this model.

 

[leerees]

What if you have 4x newer AX devices and 20x older AC devices? Very common scenario. Still reserve the 5GHz band for 4x AX devices only?

Once again, this is incorrect. If that happens on AX92U, this is another reason to avoid this model.

But that's exactly what the AX92u was built for, a gateway product as people transition from AC to AX. It provides an AC band and an AX band and it works really well.

I don't want AX and AC devices sharing the same band and loosing AX features such as TWT.

You seem to really dislike the AX92u. Asus has many routers that are far worse than the AX92u. Lots of people use AX92u's as nodes and are really happy with them.

 

[Tech9]

But that's exactly what the AX92u was built for, a gateway product as people transition from AC to AX.

No, it was built as AC “mesh” system with AX backhaul. You had to set wired AiMesh first and disconnect the cable to achieve shared AX backhaul, correct? Not too many AX92U users around.

 

[leerees]

No, it was built as AC “mesh” system with AX backhaul. You had to set wired AiMesh first and disconnect the cable to achieve shared AX backhaul, correct? Not too many AX92U users around.

It used to be like that. But they updated the firmware, giving clients access to the AX band.

 

[disjt]

Since we really veered off the initial topic, I'll add a confirmation on the ax92u. I'm a brand new ax92u user since it was on special. With the latest firmware (3.0.0.4.386.45934), I can add the nodes wirelessly. With a wireless backhaul, I can still connect my devices to the AX band on 5G2 but I'm leaving it alone. Most of my wireless devices don't need the speed so they go on the AC bands in 5G1, and the ones that need the speed are wired to the node/router. It just sucks that 160MHz on 5G2 is illegal in Canada.