RT-Ax86U PPPOE performance

[snaky69]

Good day to all, long time lurker, first time poster.

I am considering switching ISPs from cable to fiber.

Current plan is 400/50 but the 50 is hit and miss depending on congestion.

I'm looking at 1.5Gbps/940Mbps as my next move.

Thing is, I am currently using the ISP combo-box as a dumb modem having it in bridge mode while the RT-AX86U is the main node in an AiMesh setup with a 16 port switch downstairs handling various devices (a few RPI, 2 NAS, second router for isolated IoT, old laptops running BOINC, etc.)

The new ISP would require me to use PPPOE passthrough as the ONT is not removable on their box so I cannot go through a media converter. I've been perusing the web and seeing reports of poor PPPOE performance on ASUS router. I'm turning to you experienced folks to see whether the reports I read are widespread or just isolated.

That upload speed sure is tempting...

 

[Datalink]

Take a read thru the following thread:

[Internet] HomeHub 3000 bypass disaster - Bell Canada | DSLReports Forums

Forum discussion: Let me start of by stating I have read all the posts here and everywhere about people &quote;successfully&quote; bypassing the HH and getting gigabit speeds using iperf but I need a solution that does not cost me upwards of 1000 bucks, I live in Ontario and I am

www.dslreports.com

And then, if you're really interested, read thru the megathread:

Yes, you CAN bypass the HomeHub 3000!! - Bell Canada | DSLReports Forums

Forum discussion: I just had Bell Fibe installed and they gave me a HomeHub 3000. There are lots of instructions out there on how to use your own router instead of Bell's router when you have the old-style separate ONT, but I didn't find any clear instructions on how

www.dslreports.com

There are two problems to deal with, depending on your approach. If you want to toss the modem and just use the SFP+ to connect to a media converter, you need something like a Hellotek T8501S 2.5G SFP Media Converter to sync with Bell's sync rate. I'm assuming that your looking to switch to Bell's fibre service. You can't toss the HH4 however as the fibre transceiver module can't be removed from the modem, so, you're stuck with running a pass thru mode thru the modem.

The second issue is the PPPOE processing which appears to be a single thread process. Looks like you would need something with more horsepower to run PPP0E at 1.5 Gb/s rates and higher. This isn't solely an Asus router issue. It applies to other router types as well. Maybe @merlin can comment on the PPPOE processing in Asus routers.

 

[snaky69]

Take a read thru the following thread:

[Internet] HomeHub 3000 bypass disaster - Bell Canada | DSLReports Forums

Forum discussion: Let me start of by stating I have read all the posts here and everywhere about people &quote;successfully&quote; bypassing the HH and getting gigabit speeds using iperf but I need a solution that does not cost me upwards of 1000 bucks, I live in Ontario and I am

www.dslreports.com

And then, if you're really interested, read thru the megathread:

Yes, you CAN bypass the HomeHub 3000!! - Bell Canada | DSLReports Forums

Forum discussion: I just had Bell Fibe installed and they gave me a HomeHub 3000. There are lots of instructions out there on how to use your own router instead of Bell's router when you have the old-style separate ONT, but I didn't find any clear instructions on how

www.dslreports.com

There are two problems to deal with, depending on your approach. If you want to toss the modem and just use the SFP+ to connect to a media converter, you need something like a Hellotek T8501S 2.5G SFP Media Converter to sync with Bell's sync rate. I'm assuming that your looking to switch to Bell's fibre service. You can't toss the HH4 however as the fibre transceiver module can't be removed from the modem, so, you're stuck with running a pass thru mode thru the modem.

The second issue is the PPPOE processing which appears to be a single thread process. Looks like you would need something with more horsepower to run PPP0E at 1.5 Gb/s rates and higher. This isn't solely an Asus router issue. It applies to other router types as well. Maybe @merlin can comment on the PPPOE processing in Asus routers.

They’re offering the Giga Hub which looks like a fancier HH4000

 

[snaky69]

Take a read thru the following thread:

[Internet] HomeHub 3000 bypass disaster - Bell Canada | DSLReports Forums

Forum discussion: Let me start of by stating I have read all the posts here and everywhere about people &quote;successfully&quote; bypassing the HH and getting gigabit speeds using iperf but I need a solution that does not cost me upwards of 1000 bucks, I live in Ontario and I am

www.dslreports.com

And then, if you're really interested, read thru the megathread:

Yes, you CAN bypass the HomeHub 3000!! - Bell Canada | DSLReports Forums

Forum discussion: I just had Bell Fibe installed and they gave me a HomeHub 3000. There are lots of instructions out there on how to use your own router instead of Bell's router when you have the old-style separate ONT, but I didn't find any clear instructions on how

www.dslreports.com

There are two problems to deal with, depending on your approach. If you want to toss the modem and just use the SFP+ to connect to a media converter, you need something like a Hellotek T8501S 2.5G SFP Media Converter to sync with Bell's sync rate. I'm assuming that your looking to switch to Bell's fibre service. You can't toss the HH4 however as the fibre transceiver module can't be removed from the modem, so, you're stuck with running a pass thru mode thru the modem.

The second issue is the PPPOE processing which appears to be a single thread process. Looks like you would need something with more horsepower to run PPP0E at 1.5 Gb/s rates and higher. This isn't solely an Asus router issue. It applies to other router types as well. Maybe @merlin can comment on the PPPOE processing in Asus routers.

Would running my stuff in a DMZ circumvent this?

 

[Tech9]

Use the ISP equipment for the connection, connect your router behind it. Don't stress too much about your Gigabit network. You won't notice any difference between 1500/940 and 940/940 except in speed test numbers. No need to invest in new equipment just to get a better score.

 

[snaky69]

Use the ISP equipment for the connection, connect your router behind it. Don't stress too much about your Gigabit network. You won't notice any difference between 1500/940 and 940/940 except in speed test numbers. No need to invest in new equipment just to get a better score.

Nowhere did I mention purchasing new equipment?

It’s all there, wired up and working.

I would rather manage my network myself, and not rely on crappy ISP stuff. Stuff with which I’d be double-NATed with if I were to just hook it up as is. I’m running two NAS, 2 pihole + unbound instances, wireguard server, plex server, p2p downloads. I also game on my ps5. All of which would be hindered by a double NAT.

That’s why I’d rather use whatever the ISP gives me as a plain old modem and keep the rest as it is.

 

[Tech9]

Nowhere did I mention purchasing new equipment?

In case you had the intentions to upgrade to 2.5GbE network just because of >Gigabit ISP.

All of which would be hindered by a double NAT.

Not really. If you have access to your ISP device - no problem. You obviously know things. Why Asus home router, by the way?

 

[Datalink]

@snaky69 even if you were to run the modem with a dmz, or in this case a pass thru mode or address, you can't avoid the overhead processing associated with PPPOE. So, its going to be interesting to see what customers think when Bell ramps up the speeds to 5 Gb/s and beyond, which most likely won't be attainable unless you're running a custom built router with a much faster Intel or AMD processor. Yup, you can pay for those speeds when they become available, but, actually using those speeds is going to be a challange.

If you read thru some to the threads on the Bell section of DSLReports, you'll get an idea of what you're up against, in terms of running the higher speeds.

 

[snaky69]

@snaky69 even if you were to run the modem with a dmz, or in this case a pass thru mode or address, you can't avoid the overhead processing associated with PPPOE. So, its going to be interesting to see what customers think when Bell ramps up the speeds to 5 Gb/s and beyond, which most likely won't be attainable unless you're running a custom built router with a much faster Intel or AMD processor. Yup, you can pay for those speeds when they become available, but, actually using those speeds is going to be a challange.

If you read thru some to the threads on the Bell section of DSLReports, you'll get an idea of what you're up against, in terms of running the higher speeds.

I'd be perfectly fine with not reaching advertised speeds, so long as my UL speed is higher than my less-than-ideal up to 50mbps I have currently.

Food for thought.

 

[Tech9]

You will get 1500/940 at the ISP modem/router. Use 2.5GbE WAN port on your Asus for a chance of >Gigabit aggregate traffic.

 

[Datalink]

Nope, that won't work. With the Home Hub 3000, if you wanted to dump the HH3000, you could remove the SFP transceiver module and install in into a fibre/ethernet media converter. Then run ethernet into a router.

With the Home Hub 4000 and its wifi 6e successor, the Giga Hub (HH4000 + Wifi 6e), you can't remove the SFP+ transceiver module. However, both HH4000 and Giga Hub have 4 gigabit and one 10 Gb/s ethernet port, so, first hurdle, you need a router with a 10 Gb/s port. Second hurdle, you need a router that will handle PPPOE at multi gigabit speeds.

 

[Tech9]

if you wanted to dump the HH

You don't "dump" the HH. It deals with your connection, your router deals with your network. It works perfectly.

 

[Datalink]

You don't "dump" the HH. It deals with your connection, your router deals with your network. It works perfectly.

Well, if you prefer to not believe what I'm indicating, you can read thru the 160 page megathread that deals with that exact issue:

Yes, you CAN bypass the HomeHub 3000!! - Bell Canada | DSLReports Forums

Forum discussion: I just had Bell Fibe installed and they gave me a HomeHub 3000. There are lots of instructions out there on how to use your own router instead of Bell's router when you have the old-style separate ONT, but I didn't find any clear instructions on how

www.dslreports.com

Looks like several people have been using their own router for a good number of years, with the HH3000 sitting the closet gathering dust.

 

[Tech9]

As I said, not exactly necessary to bypass the ISP provided device. The issue doesn't exist for most fiber users.

 

[Marcus Yansen]

Well, if you prefer to not believe what I'm indicating, you can read thru the 160 page megathread that deals with that exact issue:

Yes, you CAN bypass the HomeHub 3000!! - Bell Canada | DSLReports Forums

Forum discussion: I just had Bell Fibe installed and they gave me a HomeHub 3000. There are lots of instructions out there on how to use your own router instead of Bell's router when you have the old-style separate ONT, but I didn't find any clear instructions on how

www.dslreports.com

Looks like several people have been using their own router for a good number of years, with the HH3000 sitting the closet gathering dust.

Yes - for 1.5 gb service u can hellotek media converter to sync at those speeds (up to 2.5 gb). So fiber into media converter and from media converter into your own router - other converter will work but only at 1 gb (allows u to keep hh3000 in closet/not use it at all)

now for higher speeds i think can only be done from isp modem router to your modem router so cant ditch router. Also u can turn off wifi urself in bell supplier and can also ask bell to turn tv wireless sigba off via special process - dont call their tech support for this

 

[snaky69]

Yes - for 1.5 gb service u can hellotek media converter to sync at those speeds (up to 2.5 gb). So fiber into media converter and from media converter into your own router - other converter will work but only at 1 gb (allows u to keep hh3000 in closet/not use it at all)

now for higher speeds i think can only be done from isp modem router to your modem router so cant ditch router. Also u can turn off wifi urself in bell supplier and can also ask bell to turn tv wireless sigba off via special process - dont call their tech support for this

They no longer give out the hh3000 do they?