Small network mixed GB and 10/100 NICS

[Doc]

Small home network (all wired). Internet access point (ISP's router) is 10/100. all 8 computers on the network have Gigabit NICs. I understand that traffic to/from the Internet will be limited by ISP and max speed of ISP access point. However, traffic between the machines is at 10/100 speeds, since traffic goes through ISP provided router.

So my trigger quick mind says "add a GB NIC to each machine, connect these through a GB (dumb) switch, and machine to machine traffic will move at GB speeds". Kinda thought data would flow through line of least resistance, as it were. Wrong.

As long as any machine can see the other through the 10/100 router, no traffic moves through the GB switch, only through original network. Disable the 10/100 connection (all these are motherboard built in NICs), or just disconnect the sender or target machine from the 10/100 net, and GB network sings. Reconnect 10/100 network and on the next traffic request, all traffic fllows though 10/100 connection, slow. I tried putting the GB NICs on a different subnet, tried using Netmask, tried putting all NICs on GB switch, plus one port of ISP router, but nothing helps.

Three machines using Windows XP, 5 machines running Win 7. Not using Homegroups, just simple file sharing. Speed doesn't seem to be a machine dependent problem, as even the two XP machines connected solely by either the built in or the new GB NIC transfer data at GB rates.

I'd really appreciate any help you can offer.

Thanks in advance,
-- Doc

 

[overdrive31]

Why not do away with using 100Mbit nics, and only use the Gbit nics? Connect Gbit nics to the switch, and then the switch to the router. All traffic behind the switch will be Gbit, so only time it will slow down is to/from the internet.

If you must do it your way. Try setting priorities under Network Connections>Advanced Menu>Advanced Settings.

 

[Doc]

thanks for the quick reply!

Your point is well taken, but the only 10/100 bit NIC is the router from the ISP. I've tried to get that upgraded, but no soap. I can only connect to the ISP through that router.

I guess my question could be better stated as follows:

If Fred is computer one, and Sam is computer 2 and Bill is computer 3 and Jane is computer 4... All computers have a working Gb NIC (10/100/1000).

All computers talk to the Internet via the ISP's 10/100 router. So I added a physically separate network made up of only Gb NICs and a switch. The only traffic possible over this network is between computers.

So Jane wants to get a file from Bill's computer, and not wait all day for it, while Fred is browsing the Internet. The file transfer needs to go at Gb speeds. Right now, it seems that Bill's computer will send the file to Jane's computer only through the 10/100, at slow speed, ignoring the nice high speed path available through the other NIC. I can see the transfer speed with a speed widget. I can readily see the difference in speeds.

Before I got the extra NICs, I tried putting everyone on a Gb switch, (each computer had only one NIC (Gb), each one indicated a Gb connection). The ISP's router then connected to the Gb switch. So all computers saw each other through the Gb switch, and saw the Internet through the Gb switch to the ISP's 10/100 router.

Same deal. Traffic only flowed between the computers at <10Mb. Note: If I disconnected the ISP router, transfers (shares) went at Gb speeds between the computers.

So I guess that if there is traffic moving through a NIC to a slower speed connection, then traffic over the network will be limited by the slower NIC?

So my logic was to set up a separate network of only Gb NICs, a Gb switch, thus nothing on that network could be held back by a slower NIC. But it appears I am missing a way of directing computer to computer traffic through the high speed network, and Internet traffic through the slower speed network. Fred, Jane, Bill et al should only converse over the faster net, and talk to the Internet only through the connection throttled by the ISPs router.

Does this clarify my setup? It's easier to be understood with voice, gestures, and maybe pencils and the back of a Denny's placemat. <g>

-- Doc

 

[overdrive31]

What you describe should not happen. Anything connected to a giga switch should all communicate at that rate. Something is wrong in the connection between router and switch. It helps to give specifics on hardware used. What switch are you using? Also, please only refer to NICs when talking about a computer, then a switch as a switch, and then a router as a router. Too confusing when you say NIC for the router or switch.

The switch have a uplink button? Try using a crossover cable instead of the uplink button. If it has a shared port and uplink port, you cannot use both at once. You must use a patch cable in the uplink port and nothing in the shared port or use the shared port(connected to a computer) and nothing in the uplink port. Likely one of these is your problem.

Your separate network idea needs priorities setup. I showed you where to setup such. You can try disabling file sharing on the internet network, and enable it on the giga. I still think it's easier to fix the issue at the switch than to create two networks.

If I don't make sense, it's because your explanation is rather confusing.

 

[Nerre]

It should work with a gigabit switch between the computers and the router.

If you just got 10 Mbit speeds there must have been something else wrong.

 

[Doc]

Network connection preferences

Sorry I couldn't make my problem clear enough. Voice, coffee, a pencil, and the back of a denny's placemat have always worked better for me.

Computers connected via a (unmanaged) Gigabyte switch, using Gigabyte network adapters. The gigabyte switch also connects to the Internet gateway which is only a 10/100 device.

Trying to share files between computers was always at 10/100 speeds as long as the Internet gateway was connected, whether or not there was traffic to the Internet.

I added a GB NIC to each computer, and a GB switch, connecting the computers. There was no connection to the Internet on this network, all connections were GB capable.

I could not get traffic to flow between the computers across that second network unless the first network was disconnected from each computer.
Each physical network would indeed work at GB speed as long as it was the only network connected, and no 10/100 device was present.

1) Each network was physically capable of working at GB speeds.
2) the computers seemed to use the first network (the one with the 10/100 Internet connection on the network), exclusively. As long as the 10/100 Internet gateway was attached, traffic flowed between the computers at slow speeds.
3) Thus some way had to be provided to direct computer to computer traffic through the second network. Hence my question of this august body of experts.

I finally learned that setting network priorities was possible in windows, thanks to a tip from a user here. Thanks again!

So it appears now that if there is a request to connect to the Internet, the computer looks to the first listed network adapter (the local only network). Whoops! No Internet connection there! Let's try the second network. Success!

If however, there is a request to connect to a computer on the network, the first network in the priority list find the target computer, and data zips along at top speed.

Whether or not this is the right solution, the most elegant solution, the most technically ingenious solution, or one which would earn me an A in a networking class, I care not. The NICs and router cost me nothing, it seemed the easiest solution, and it works. So I can stop pestering you guys.

Really, thanks to those who offered solutions, I am sorry I could not express my problems in as elegant and succinct a manner to please all. But due to the patience of a couple of you, my problem is solved, and I will fade away into the cloud.

-- Doc

 

[RocketJSquirrel]

Computers connected via a (unmanaged) Gigabyte switch, using Gigabyte network adapters.

I hope you aren't really expecting gigabyte speeds from a gigabit network.



Glad you got your issue resolved.

 

[stevech]

Another example of people confusing
Gbps = gigabits per second
GBps = gigabytes per second (big B)

8 bits in one byte

bytes per second = bits per second divided by 8

WiFi connection megabits/sec (Mbps) is the raw bit rate. Net yield after WiFi and IP overhead is about 60% of WiFi connection speed, absent competition for air time among nearby WiFi.

 

[Doc]

GB Gb confusion

Yes, I am very much aware of the differences in Giga bits Giga Bytes, 1000 vs 1024, max speed versus actual speed and all the rest. The current "intelligence" and advertising BS throws around a lot of buzzwords. Like your car, for instance. The speedometer oes to 140 or more MPH. But do you really think you will ever actually drive it that fast???

My main objective was to ensure that I had a channel with enough capacity to move data between the computers as fast as possible. Variables: processor, throughput, disk transfer capacity, and on and on. All I care about is that I had a pipe (if you will) big enough to transfer data as fast as the sender could send and the receiver could receive. I proved now that I have just that. By making the path between the computers a "Gigabyte" network (whteverthehell that means in reality), and getting the data to use that path, Inow can transfer files 4 or 5 times faster than before. No more, no less.
But just for defecations and risiibilities, I set all the machines to transferring huge files amongst themselves while the main machine was servicing several torrents over my FiOS 75/75 connection. The file transfers were 4 or 5 times faster than before, and the torrents maxed out the horseshit FiOS router. I realize throughput depends on the capabilities of the pipe, the machines at either end, traffic encountered along the way, etc etc etc. Just because you buy a Gigabyte switch, NIC, whatever, doesn't mean you will automatically transfer data at a Gigabyte per second, or Furlong per fortnight or whatever. However, like the 140 MPH on your Toyota or whatever, with all the right conditions, you MIGHT be able to go that fast. But I doubt that you would be abe to do it very long.

And one last parting shot. My '68 Chevelle Malibu SuperSport convertible with the 350 engine has 140 on the speedo, and it WILL do 140 as long as the cops on I-10 don't catch me. Did it once. Been there. Got the T-shirt. Got the ticket. Yes, it CAN do it. But not very practical.

I think the advertisements etc for routers, NICs, and all the rest should have the "YMMV" disclaimer.

-- Doc
In Taylor, TX awaiting my Westbound engine with 140 loaded coal cars. Highball!
drdumont.webs.com/miscellaneous

 

[stevech]

Wired ethernet, even consumer stuff (with very rare exception) does get the wire-speeds we expect. We expect speeds for transfers are limited by disks and file systems' overhead. On each end. We know 1qBT vs. 100BT vs. 1000BT. We know what the lights on switches mean, speed-wise.

WiFi, being wireless, being mis-marketed, being subject to the interference and competition for air time in urban areas, and so on, is mainly misunderstood.
Many think a WiFi router is like a transmit-only radio broadcast station. Because few WiFi routers show users the received signal strength by client.

 

[Nerre]

Computers connected via a (unmanaged) Gigabyte switch, using Gigabyte network adapters. The gigabyte switch also connects to the Internet gateway which is only a 10/100 device.

Trying to share files between computers was always at 10/100 speeds as long as the Internet gateway was connected, whether or not there was traffic to the Internet.

That sounds strange, did you try using another switch?

Because that is the way I have my network set up and it works... (Ok, I even have two switches, one gigabit and one 10/100, but in any case the computers on the gigabit switch get full speed between eachother.)

I could not get traffic to flow between the computers across that second network unless the first network was disconnected from each computer.

This is because your computer only had one of the networks set up as a default network. If a computer is connected to more than one network, both networks must use different IP-adresses (I think) AND (more important) you must set up routing rules telling the computer which traffic should go to which network.

In essence, any computer with more than one NIC is a router!