Upgrading from 40MHz router to something better,

[aliitp]

Hi,

So I have been using the Legendary R7000 for more than 7 years, Two routers in a Bridge Mode, its really fascinating to see the new AX finally putting 160 MHz channel width into work ! But as I said I have both routers on Bridge Mode (line of sight, 5 meters away) for the sole purpose of getting Best Throughput !

Sometime when i login to the router control panel i feel discouraged when i see link speed of just 867 MHz (what does that mean in practice??) instead of the maximum supported 1300 MHz, but to be honest I hardly see any difference in terms of Throughput ! having a WD My Cloud connected to the main router via Gigabit, I am Thrilled every time i transfer a huge file to read speeds just below 600 Mbps Throughput, I honestly have 0 complains with my 7 years+ old setup, but reading there is actually 80 MHz supporting 802.11 AC Products, so how much more speed can I see and is it worth upgrading from a 20/40 MHz setup to another 802.11 AC Router ? or should I Jump and get the 160 MHz 802.11 AX (mainly the ASUS One) ? Something tells my My Cloud HDD can do faster than just 600 Mbps Throughout over air, and am a speed freak, besides range is not all the great on the R7000, so is it a good idea spending probably 800$ on a new Router/Bridge setup ??

Many thanks,

 

[Val D.]

You have to realize your routers share the channels with other routers around you. Theoretical maximum bandwidth is possible only if you live in the middle of nowhere and your routers are the only devices around transmitting and receiving data. Your R7000 routers support 20/40/80MHz on AC. Why is your setup limited to 20/40MHz? Your LAN ports support up to 1Gbps speeds. No matter how fast the link between the routers is, you are limited to up to 1Gbps for connected devices. If your routers are in line of sight only 5m away, why you transfer data over WiFi? Just use a LAN cable and you don't have to share the bandwidth with other WiFi routers around. Actually, what is your question? I have a feeling you don't have clear idea how things work and what you want to achieve.

 

[aliitp]

You have to realize your routers share the channels with other routers around you. Theoretical maximum bandwidth is possible only if you live in the middle of nowhere and your routers are the only devices around transmitting and receiving data. Your R7000 routers support 20/40/80MHz on AC. Why is your setup limited to 20/40MHz? Your LAN ports support up to 1Gbps speeds. No matter how fast the link between the routers is, you are limited to up to 1Gbps for connected devices. If your routers are in line of sight only 5m away, why you transfer data over WiFi? Just use a LAN cable and you don't have to share the bandwidth with other WiFi routers around. Actually, what is your question? I have a feeling you don't have clear idea how things work and what you want to achieve.

Well, I have gone through SNB review here and i cant find it no where pointed that my router is capable of 80 MHz
https://www.smallnetbuilder.com/wir...1900-first-look-netgear-r7000-a-asus-rt-ac68u

i can say for sure however it can support up to 1300 Mbps theoretical bandwidth, The routers are line of sight approx 5 meters away, I have set them up this way and I like to keep it this way, the idea of having Wireless routers is to get rid of Wires I believe, and my bridge is connected to multiple devices via ethernet, that's pretty much it for me and id like to keep it this way !...

I believe I made my question pretty clear and shared my Experience really clear, if you cant make sense out of it simply read it again or don't

I said i am seeing maximum throughput of just below 600 Mbps over my WLAN, and am using R7000 as Router/Bridge setup, am not stupid so i know i cant go beyond the gigabit ethernet speed ! its Not rocket science !...

All am asking if I upgrade to a Router/Bridge setup with Two: asus gt-ac5300 or maybe go with the highest end AX Routers in the market (again TWO ROUTER/BRIDGE SETUP) will I ever be able to see faster than the current speeds am seeing with my R7000 setup ?

I hope someone who has such a Router/Bridge setup can provide feedback on the maximum throughput they are seeing when routers are properly setup (preferably line of sight) as i believe its an Ideal setup design !...

 

[Val D.]

Well, I have gone through SNB review here and i cant find it no where pointed that my router is capable of 80 MHz
https://www.smallnetbuilder.com/wir...1900-first-look-netgear-r7000-a-asus-rt-ac68u

Really?
Page 3, Wireless Performance:
"Each router was first reset to factory defaults and Channel 6 was set for 2.4 GHz and Channel 153 for 5 GHz. 20 MHz bandwidth mode was set for 2.4 GHz and 80 MHz mode was set for 5 GHz. The test client was connected using WPA2/AES encryption."

If your router doesn't support 80MHz on 5GHz, then how come is the theoretical maximum 1300Mbps?
Again, no matter what link speed you achieve between the routers, your LAN devices can't go higher than 1Gbps due to LAN ports limitations, your attached storage can't go higher than it's own hardware limitations and so on.

If you like to spend $800 on new routers, just go ahead. Most people will run a $5 cable and call it a day.
And if you run a cable your neighbors will thank you for not taking constantly all the capacity of available channels for no reason.

In case this information is valuable for you, I can have constant 1300Mbps link between RT-AC86U and RT-AC66U (3 streams, 80MHz) and constant 1733Mbps link between 2 x RT-AC86U (4 streams, 80MHz). Tested, working. See my signature below - Router + Bridge. It doesn't mean though I can transfer data on those speeds at any given moment. As I mentioned before, wireless channels are shared between all routers using the same channels - yours and your neighbor's too.

Also, don't forget the fact the Bridge router is sharing bandwidth with all your wireless devices connected to the Router router. The maximum theoretical speed is shared between all devices and limited with channel available bandwidth. Your Bridge is just one of the devices on your network. Look at it as an expensive WiFi adapter, nothing more. With this setup you basically limit all those devices up to your available WiFi bandwidth. In my case I do it because I don't want to drill walls, the Router and the Bridge are in different rooms. I can transfer files between the two with about 90MB/sec in good conditions, usually around 60MB/sec.

 

[aliitp]

Really?
Page 3, Wireless Performance:
"Each router was first reset to factory defaults and Channel 6 was set for 2.4 GHz and Channel 153 for 5 GHz. 20 MHz bandwidth mode was set for 2.4 GHz and 80 MHz mode was set for 5 GHz. The test client was connected using WPA2/AES encryption."

If your router doesn't support 80MHz on 5GHz, then how come is the theoretical maximum 1300Mbps?
Again, no matter what link speed you achieve between the routers, your LAN devices can't go higher than 1Gbps due to LAN ports limitations, your attached storage can't go higher than it's own hardware limitations and so on.

If you like to spend $800 on new routers, just go ahead. Most people will run a $5 cable and call it a day.
And if you run a cable your neighbors will thank you for not taking constantly all the capacity of available channels for no reason.

In case this information is valuable for you, I can have constant 1300Mbps link between RT-AC86U and RT-AC66U (3 streams, 80MHz) and constant 1733Mbps link between 2 x RT-AC86U (4 streams, 80MHz). Tested, working. See my signature below - Router + Bridge. It doesn't mean though I can transfer data on those speeds at any given moment. As I mentioned before, wireless channels are shared between all routers using the same channels - yours and your neighbor's too.

Also, don't forget the fact the Bridge router is sharing bandwidth with all your wireless devices connected to the Router router. The maximum theoretical speed is shared between all devices and limited with channel available bandwidth. Your Bridge is just one of the devices on your network. Look at it as an expensive WiFi adapter, nothing more. With this setup you basically limit all those devices up to your available WiFi bandwidth. In my case I do it because I don't want to drill walls, the Router and the Bridge are in different rooms. I can transfer files between the two with about 90MB/sec in good conditions, usually around 60MB/sec.

Am not really sure if you are reading my requirements and questions carefully or your are just trying to come out as a winner in this topic, either ways you are giving me really a nice time replying to you in late afternoon when am really free and got nothing more important to do !...

So here it is...

Thanks for clarifying to me my router is actually 80 MHz capable i found this out myself yesterday when i was reading this useful topic:
https://www.duckware.com/tech/wifi-in-the-us.html

It made me understand More aspects about the WiFi standards than posting my question here !...

Am not really complaining in this thread about the Cost of new routers setup, not sure why this pisses you off or you are trying to give an advise in a weird narcissistic way !... You are admitting yourself that you have the same Router/Bridge Setup that I have, luckily you get better throughput than i do though, then why r u giving me crap about using a 5$ cable when YOU are clearly on a wifi router/bridge setup same as me !!

As i said am asking for a simple advise from an experienced snbforums members, and the advise am after is AGAIN so simple as follows:-
===
I hope someone who has such a Router/Bridge setup can provide feedback on the maximum throughput they are seeing when routers are properly setup (preferably line of sight) as i believe its an Ideal setup design !...
===

Thats it ! no need to give me unnecessary crap about things i didnt ask for and making your own assumptions while you are thousands of miles away in Canada because probably the same reasons that made you do this router/bridge setup is why others do it too !...

>>> I can transfer files between the two with about 90MB/sec in good conditions, usually around 60MB/sec.
Good News, I wish I had those speed, I just Don't, and its probably because the Router/Bridge setup am using are probably older than your's, you got better router/bridge there bud, or maybe you are in an ideal location with minimum to no interference !...

Again READ THIS FOR GOD SAKE am not an idiot who thinks i will get 1.3 Gbps wifi speeds, I HAVE BEEN DOING WIFI TESTS SINCE 802.11 B/G and i know for DAMN SURE those speeds are Neither best case scenarios nor will EVER occur in real world ! they are lab results as i was told here in SNB forums by the moderator himself just cant recall where !...

You might or might not know this that due to WiFi Overhead you are losing at least -55% of the reported PHYSICAL/LINK speed, so yeah when you see 1300 Mbps you are probably getting around 500-600 Mbps throughput only *in my case at least* (due other factors such as Client QAM, the Client MIMO, distance from router will contribute to lower speeds...) thats why i like using a router and a bridge (a more expensive adapter as you call it and admit of using your own) to get best results possible !...

Thanks for your time !...

 

[ACwifiguy]

From my understanding in your network you have two r7000s. They are connected via wireless and your wireless devices connect to these access points. One of these i’m guessing is the router (DHCP server) and the other is an access point that is on a wireless bridge with the other.

The r7000 has three 5ghz AC antennas - so 433mbps x 3 under ideal conditions. The vast majority of wireless clients only have two antennas so you’ll never see beyond 866 mbps, ever - if your devices are two antenna clients this is why you are seeing 866. In real world use you’ll get 500-800 mbps depending on your distance from the router. Don’t read the numbers on the sides of the router box - all those throughputs are massively overinflated and assume you have a professional level wireless client with 4 antennas standing 3 ft away from the router. All throughput is limited by your client devices (2 antenna - max 866 mbps).

If your r7000s are indeed wirelessly connected like I mentioned in the first paragraph you are losing some of your bandwidth because the r7000s are using some of the antennas and antenna time talking with the other r7000. This allows less antenna attention towards your clients. Wired > wireless. That is what I would fix. I’d buy cat 6 cable to connect your r7000’s. Your r7000s via wired and you would enjoy up to 866 mbps. You won’t get much better performance with any of the new consumer grade routers.

 

[avtella]

Am not really sure if you are reading my requirements and questions carefully or your are just trying to come out as a winner in this topic, either ways you are giving me really a nice time replying to you in late afternoon when am really free and got nothing more important to do !...

So here it is...

Thanks for clarifying to me my router is actually 80 MHz capable i found this out myself yesterday when i was reading this useful topic:
https://www.duckware.com/tech/wifi-in-the-us.html

It made me understand More aspects about the WiFi standards than posting my question here !...

Am not really complaining in this thread about the Cost of new routers setup, not sure why this pisses you off or you are trying to give an advise in a weird narcissistic way !... You are admitting yourself that you have the same Router/Bridge Setup that I have, luckily you get better throughput than i do though, then why r u giving me crap about using a 5$ cable when YOU are clearly on a wifi router/bridge setup same as me !!

As i said am asking for a simple advise from an experienced snbforums members, and the advise am after is AGAIN so simple as follows:-
===
I hope someone who has such a Router/Bridge setup can provide feedback on the maximum throughput they are seeing when routers are properly setup (preferably line of sight) as i believe its an Ideal setup design !...
===

Thats it ! no need to give me unnecessary crap about things i didnt ask for and making your own assumptions while you are thousands of miles away in Canada because probably the same reasons that made you do this router/bridge setup is why others do it too !...

>>> I can transfer files between the two with about 90MB/sec in good conditions, usually around 60MB/sec.
Good News, I wish I had those speed, I just Don't, and its probably because the Router/Bridge setup am using are probably older than your's, you got better router/bridge there bud, or maybe you are in an ideal location with minimum to no interference !...

Again READ THIS FOR GOD SAKE am not an idiot who thinks i will get 1.3 Gbps wifi speeds, I HAVE BEEN DOING WIFI TESTS SINCE 802.11 B/G and i know for DAMN SURE those speeds are Neither best case scenarios nor will EVER occur in real world ! they are lab results as i was told here in SNB forums by the moderator himself just cant recall where !...

You might or might not know this that due to WiFi Overhead you are losing at least -55% of the reported PHYSICAL/LINK speed, so yeah when you see 1300 Mbps you are probably getting around 500-600 Mbps throughput only *in my case at least* (due other factors such as Client QAM, the Client MIMO, distance from router will contribute to lower speeds...) thats why i like using a router and a bridge (a more expensive adapter as you call it and admit of using your own) to get best results possible !...

Thanks for your time !...

A 1300 Mbps wifi adapter paired with a 3x3/4x4 router can get you close to 900-950 Mbps peak rates depending on distance, home construction materials, and other forms of interference, not all test environments are the same. That duckware link is all right but that guy has a habit of trying to refute almost in a condescending way (in a reddit thread) that anyone can even reach 600 Mbps on a 866 Mbps adapter, which various reviews like notebook-check show is possible and in my own testing as well. I can get a sustained 600-640 Mbps directly one floor below my router on my Dell 7577 with an AX200 in ac mode when doing transfers to router connected external storage.

 

[Val D.]

...why r u giving me crap about using a 5$ cable when YOU are clearly on a wifi router/bridge setup same as me !!

I did explain why, but you missed it. I did explain what the result is, but you missed it. It's really nice though you discovered your routers actually support 80MHz... after 7 years.

I'm looking at your other questions on SNB and I believe you first need to get yourself familiar with how WiFi works. It doesn't matter what data transfers I can achieve in Canada, someone else in France and a third person in Japan. No one knows how many active networks you have around your place and how busy they are. You may have a link speed of 1733Mbps and still not be able to transfer 5MB/sec due to channel congestion. All I'm trying to tell you is that the answers you expect have no usable value in your particular environment and your solutions are very far from ideal. Feel free to buy whatever equipment you like, but the results won't be much different of what you see at the moment.

Good luck!