ZenWiFi XT8 as AiMesh node - how to select 5GHz-1 channel?

[Qbcd]

Sort of a follow-up to my other thread where I was trying to figure out if there's a way to use the 5GHz-2 (4x4 160MHz) band on the XT8 as both backhaul and fronthaul with AiMesh. Spoiler alert - you can't. You can only use it as backhaul.

Okay, so I'm using the other band for devices. However, now I've run into another problem and that is that there is no way to control the channel of that band when using AiMesh. 5 GHz-1 can only do channels 36-64 with 80 MHz max. So it will either use channel 36 or channel 52. However, there is no way to select which. I want to use channel 52 because it's DFS and completely clear, whereas there are 6 nearby APs in 36-52.

When I first connected the node, it defaulted to channel 52 which is what I want. However, I rebooted it once and it then went back to the super congested non-DFS 80 MHz channel, and I've rebooted it 5 times since then and it stays on that channel... And because there's always one guy who asks why use DFS - because it's clear and I'm not near radar, I use channel 100 non-stop without issues.

I don't even know if I have a question, but posting in case someone has thoughts. I can't believe they don't let you select the fronthaul channel. The only way appears to be to set it up in Repeater mode, but I don't want to do that. My main router is an AX86U.

 

[OzarkEdge]

Sort of a follow-up to my other thread where I was trying to figure out if there's a way to use the 5GHz-2 (4x4 160MHz) band on the XT8 as both backhaul and fronthaul with AiMesh. Spoiler alert - you can't. You can only use it as backhaul.

Okay, so I'm using the other band for devices. However, now I've run into another problem and that is that there is no way to control the channel of that band when using AiMesh. 5 GHz-1 can only do channels 36-64 with 80 MHz max. So it will either use channel 36 or channel 52. However, there is no way to select which. I want to use channel 52 because it's DFS and completely clear, whereas there are 6 nearby APs in 36-52.

When I first connected the node, it defaulted to channel 52 which is what I want. However, I rebooted it once and it then went back to the super congested non-DFS 80 MHz channel, and I've rebooted it 5 times since then and it stays on that channel... And because there's always one guy who asks why use DFS - because it's clear and I'm not near radar, I use channel 100 non-stop without issues.

I don't even know if I have a question, but posting in case someone has thoughts. I can't believe they don't let you select the fronthaul channel. The only way appears to be to set it up in Repeater mode, but I don't want to do that. My main router is an AX86U.

Are you using Smart Connect? Can you post a pic of your 5-1 bandwidth/channel settings. 5-1 being confined to low 5.0GHz and 5-2 to high 5.0GHz is to be expected, but you should be able to select bw and ch within those constraints.

OE

 

[Qbcd]

Are you using Smart Connect? Can you post a pic of your 5-1 bandwidth/channel settings. 5-1 being confined to low 5.0GHz and 5-2 to high 5.0GHz is to be expected, but you should be able to select bw and ch within those constraints.

OE

I am using SmartConnect unfortunately, don't want to, but I have to... But I don't think it makes a difference.

I can't access any 5-1 bandwidth/channel settings. I am using AiMesh with the main router being an AX86U. I can select the main router's channel, which then connects to 5GHz-2 on the XT8, but 5GHz-1 on the XT8 I have no control over when it's an AiMesh node.

5 GHz-1 can only do 80 MHz in channels 36-64, so it will either go to the lower non-DFS channel range that is always congested, or the upper DFS range. I sort of figured out that when I first add the XT8 as an AiMesh node, it goes to the DFS 80 MHz channel - what I want. But then if I restart the node, it will sometimes (possibly always) default to the non-DFS range. And no further restarts help, the only way to get the DFS channel again is to remove the node and re-add it.

 

[OzarkEdge]

I am using SmartConnect unfortunately, don't want to, but I have to... But I don't think it makes a difference.

I find that disabling Smart Connect does affect the settings offered... but this may not affect what you are seeing there. I keep it disabled and use same SSIDs.

I've also noticed that when trying different bw/ch settings, I sometimes need to Apply intermediate settings before the GUI offers 'other' options... a small anomaly in the firmware logic, imo.

I would configure first for no 160MHz, no DFS, across all nodes. See how that behaves and then experiment with trying to use DFS at your location.

OE

 

[aidil]

Sort of a follow-up to my other thread where I was trying to figure out if there's a way to use the 5GHz-2 (4x4 160MHz) band on the XT8 as both backhaul and fronthaul with AiMesh. Spoiler alert - you can't. You can only use it as backhaul.

There's the option on the web GUI: Wireless - General - Band: 5 GHz-2 (Backhaul) -> AiMesh Wireless Backhaul: Use as backhaul and fronthaul connection

 

[tgl]

It sounds to me like the problem is that the AIMesh GUI configures itself to what the primary node can do (two radios in this case), and so there's no GUI option to configure the secondary's third radio.

I wonder whether you wouldn't be well advised to swap the two nodes and use the XT8 as your primary. Or give up on AIMesh and configure the XT8 independently as a repeater. It's not clear to me that AIMesh brings anything to the table beyond a pretty (and restrictive) GUI.

 

[Qbcd]

There's the option on the web GUI: Wireless - General - Band: 5 GHz-2 (Backhaul) -> AiMesh Wireless Backhaul: Use as backhaul and fronthaul connection

I don't see that. Maybe you'd see that if you're using two XT8s, but I have a main AX86U and an XT8 node.

It sounds to me like the problem is that the AIMesh GUI configures itself to what the primary node can do (two radios in this case), and so there's no GUI option to configure the secondary's third radio.

I wonder whether you wouldn't be well advised to swap the two nodes and use the XT8 as your primary. Or give up on AIMesh and configure the XT8 independently as a repeater. It's not clear to me that AIMesh brings anything to the table beyond a pretty (and restrictive) GUI.

I agree, I researched this further since posting, and with a dual-band as the main router and a tri-band as the node, there is no way to control the node's 2nd 5 GHz band at all. And there's no way to use the backhaul as fronthaul too.

I don't want to use the XT8 as my primary, I'm using aftermarket antennas and I like to have the AX86U as my main. I still don't want to use the XT8 as an AP, I want to use AiMesh's roaming, and I like monitoring everything in one place.

What I figured out using WiFi Analyzer is that when first set up the XT8 will use 5GHz-1 on channel 52 with an 80 MHz channel, which is what I would set it up to do anyway. As long as I don't restart it, it stays on that channel, at least it has for the past week, so let's see...

But yeah, Asus should definitely improve the AiMesh GUI to work better with different combinations of routers, but I'm not holding my breath, there is so much lack of basic functionality and broken stuff that they have ignored, this won't be high on their list.

 

[tgl]

Are you sure that AIMesh offers any roaming ability that you don't get anyway? In the end, roaming is mostly on the clients.

 

[Qbcd]

Are you sure that AIMesh offers any roaming ability that you don't get anyway? In the end, roaming is mostly on the clients.

I think so, without AiMesh or Roaming Assistant, I think dumber clients will just hold onto the current AP until signal is too weak and they disconnect. And I think Roaming Assistant just forces a disconnect at a certain RSSI. For me AiMesh + Smart Connect (without Roaming Assistant) works well. But to be fair I haven't tested all possible combinations.

 

[aidil]

I don't see that. Maybe you'd see that if you're using two XT8s, but I have a main AX86U and an XT8 node.

My XT8's are actually nodes too. But, my main is the GT-AX11000 Pro.

Prior getting the GT-AX11000 Pro, my main was one of the XT8's and the "Use as both backhaul and fronthaul connection" option was there too. So, looks like it's a tri-band thing.

 

[Qbcd]

My XT8's are actually nodes too. But, my main is the GT-AX11000 Pro.

Prior getting the GT-AX11000 Pro, my main was one of the XT8's and the "Use as both backhaul and fronthaul connection" option was there too. So, looks like it's a tri-band thing.

Right, makes sense. I can't even select band with SC turned on. Do you have the option to turn off 5GHz-1 on the nodes and only use the backhaul as fronthaul? By default, does it use both and just decide which band to put clients on based on capacity?

The thing is, with XT8s, the backhaul will be channel 100, which in Europe has a 30 dbm power limit, 7 dbm higher than channels 36-64. So it reaches much farther and clients will prefer it if they have the option (and are smart enough). That's why it's great to use it as fronthaul too if it's not too much of a bottleneck, and even if it is it might be worth it. In the US though, the power limit for those channels is 23 dbm, so you don't gain anything in terms of range.

 

[aidil]

Do you have the option to turn off 5GHz-1 on the nodes and only use the backhaul as fronthaul? By default, does it use both and just decide which band to put clients on based on capacity?

There are options to switch on/off each radio band on each node. So, it should be possible to turn off the 5 GHz-1 and use the 5 GHz-2 as fronthaul connection on the node as long as "Use as both backhaul and fronthaul connection" option is selected.

Sorry, I cannot test it. It's Saturday morning time here in Indonesia. My kids and the mistress are fully awake and will be screaming if I disrupt the internet.

I think by default, the AiMesh chooses the (most) stable radio as the backhaul connection. But, for the fronthaul connection, seems the consensus says it's the clients who choose which radio to connect to, although, there are Steering Trigger Condition options (which in my case, I keep them default) on the Wireless - Smart Connect Rule menu, which probably could be set to direct clients per rules.

 

[Qbcd]

There are options to switch on/off each radio band on each node. So, it should be possible to turn off the 5 GHz-1 and use the 5 GHz-2 as fronthaul connection on the node as long as "Use as both backhaul and fronthaul connection" option is selected.

Sorry, I cannot test it. It's Saturday morning time here in Indonesia. My kids and the mistress are fully awake and will be screaming if I disrupt the internet.

I think by default, the AiMesh chooses the (most) stable radio as the backhaul connection. But, for the fronthaul connection, seems the consensus says it's the clients who choose which radio to connect to, although, there are Steering Trigger Condition options (which in my case, I keep them default) on the Wireless - Smart Connect Rule menu, which probably could be set to direct clients per rules.

Thanks for the reply. I have those options too, but with a dual-band router as main and tri-band as node, they are glitchy. If I turn off 5 GHz-1, then both 5 GHz bands turn off after about a minute. If I turn it back on, then both turn on. Most of the time. But if I try to only turn off 5 GHz-2 for instance, sometimes both turn off, sometimes it glitches and the node has to be manually reset. And of course I don't have the "Use as both backhaul and fronthaul connection" option.

Anyway, I'm sure for you it would work, the issue is only when you have a dual-band as the main with tri-band as node(s) it seems. And Asus doesn't seem to care enough to fix it and give a setup like mine with an AX86U main and XT8 node the option to only use 5 GHz-2 as back and fronthaul, and/or to select 5 GHz-1 channel on the node. I guess it's quite a niche use case, so they don't want to spend man hours on it.

 

[SantaBee]

I have the same use scenario and cannot find a solution. Asus is so disappointing.

 

[kildare]

In my XT8 Mesh with wireless backhaul, on laptops with 160 MHz AX wifi card I have set their wifi cards to connect directly to the backhaul network, with no problems using this connection for these clients.

 

[glens]

Likely what's happening in this case:

XT8's 5-1 does NOT "do" DFS. So when first booting up the 5-1 is available immediately while 5-2 is on timeout listening for Radar events. So 5-1 gets used as backhaul.

 

[glens]

What happens when everything is down, the XT8 is brought up told to be configured as a mesh node and let it sit for 11 minutes that way, then bring up the router, let it sit for 11 minutes, THEN "add the node?" Will the router then opt for the better 5-2 as the node's backhaul?

 

[Qbcd]

I don't know, the way I solved that problem was to replace the XT8 with an AX82U. Now I can use the same clear DFS channel with the higher power limit for backhaul and clients, and it stays on the channel I want it. How stupid that having one less band is actually more useful.