2019 Google Nest Router is impressive

[sbsnb]

Well, many of us have moved on to 4K HDR televisions and programming. I get 4K from Netflix, Amazon Prime, Disney+, and even Vudu. Since there's more than one person in our home, we might have two or more 4K streams at once.

Also, almost everything I do on the web is faster for having 1 Gbps service from AT&T Fiber. I download and upload documents all the time, as well as images, and occasionally video. Windows 10 updates are also faster to download, as is everything else – Linux distros, the latest version of Golang or Python, Office updates, etc.

Even Disney+, which is a retarded bandwidth hog compared to every other streaming service, uses about 8 mbps. A 50 mbps speed is enough for 6 simultaneous Disney+ streams.

I'm not saying no one "needs" more than 50 mbps, but a lot of people severely overestimate the bandwidth necessary for smooth operations of their services. I think a lot of it has to do with marketing by ISPs.

 

[sbsnb]

The Nest WiFi mesh points have no Ethernet. This is less flexible, but makes sense since most people buying mesh don't have an Ethernet-connect option.

I don't think removing flexibility ever makes sense unless the cost of providing it is so prohibitively high that it's actually unsustainable.

 

[thiggins]

I don't think removing flexibility ever makes sense unless the cost of providing it is so prohibitively high that it's actually unsustainable.

It's not just material cost, but service/support, too. More options = more chance for users to mess up and reach out to support.

 

[sbsnb]

It's not just material cost, but service/support, too. More options = more chance for users to mess up and reach out to support.

Do people still provide competent tech support? I don't even know why most tech support departments exist. 99% of the time they seem designed to frustrate and annoy the customer rather than help.

Dumping some unskilled people with scripts to follow in various scenarios, and repeat 'I'm sorry' if they can't find a script to follow for you situation is not good support. Good support requires people with actual product knowledge. If the tech support agent can't plan and implement a mesh network on their own without instructions, they're not going to be good tech support. /rant

I think in those cases the money would be better spent improving the flexibility of the product. It would also increase the likelihood that a customer could make it work.

 

[thiggins]

I take your point about support on consumer electronics in general. But what do you expect for something that people won't pay for, either directly or indirectly (higher product cost)?

 

[10gig]

The Nest WiFi mesh points have no Ethernet. This is less flexible, but makes sense since most people buying mesh don't have an Ethernet-connect option.

I don't understand what you mean. Wired backhaul is rather common with mesh systems. Netgear Orbi supports it. Plume supports it. eero supports it. I don't know what options most mesh buyers have, but MoCA would seem to give everyone the option.

 

[thiggins]

I don't understand what you mean. Wired backhaul is rather common with mesh systems. Netgear Orbi supports it. Plume supports it. eero supports it. I don't know what options most mesh buyers have, but MoCA would seem to give everyone the option.

The whole purpose of wireless mesh is wireless connection between APs.

I understand that many mesh systems support wired backhaul, but it is not required for mesh *wireless* systems. Once you connect "mesh" nodes via Ethernet, you no longer have mesh wireless. You have an automatically-managed multi-AP system.

The (non-technical) majority of people who buy mesh systems are the same people using Wi-Fi extenders to try to improve Wi-Fi coverage or performance. Mesh is seen as a next step up.

 

[10gig]

Even Disney+, which is a retarded bandwidth hog compared to every other streaming service, uses about 8 mbps. A 50 mbps speed is enough for 6 simultaneous Disney+ streams.

I'm not saying no one "needs" more than 50 mbps, but a lot of people severely overestimate the bandwidth necessary for smooth operations of their services. I think a lot of it has to do with marketing by ISPs.

Where did these numbers come from? 8 Mbps is a typical average for 1080p. Netflix recommends at least 25 Mbps for a single 4K stream, and they're absolute masters of compression, incredibly talented. According to this test, The Mandalorian on Disney+ was peaking at 28 Mbps and averaging 16 Mbps, which sounds about right.

In any event, I haven't had 50 Mbps service in many, many years. It would be a huge slowdown at this point, for all the tasks I mentioned. Computers are too slow as it is – at this point in history I feel like computing should be instant and it frustrates me that it isn't.

 

[10gig]

The whole purpose of wireless mesh is wireless connection between APs.

I understand that many mesh systems support wired backhaul, but it is not required for mesh *wireless* systems. Once you connect "mesh" nodes via Ethernet, you no longer have mesh wireless. You have an automatically-managed multi-AP system.

The (non-technical) majority of people who buy mesh systems are the same people using Wi-Fi extenders to try to improve Wi-Fi coverage or performance. Mesh is seen as a next step up.

I wouldn't get hung up on whether we should still call it mesh. Wired is always better than wireless, and wired backhaul does wonders for "mesh" performance. I recommend that everyone use wired backhaul.

My impression was that mesh buyers tended to be optimizers, more technical prosumer types, but I could be wrong. They're expensive systems, so I think you'd have to know their value to be interested in them. Maybe you just have to be rich or affluent.

 

[sbsnb]

Where did these numbers come from?

My RT-AC88U.

8 Mbps is a typical average for 1080p. Netflix recommends at least 25 Mbps for a single 4K stream, and they're absolute masters of compression, incredibly talented.

I don't know about 4K, but I have my Netflix set at 720p because I can't see the difference from 8 feet away on a 65" screen. Netflix uses about 1.7 mbps at that setting. Disney+ has no settings and uses about 10 mbps.