Adding wireless to a wired network

[Smithcraft]

Hello all,

I've had a wired network for years, and just recently acquired a tablet, so I needed to set up a wired network. Despite using computers since the early 80s, I still consider networking to be black magic, so be gentle please!

The existing network starts with the cable modem and then Cat5 over to a Linksys BEFSR81. From there the Linksys serves the two desktops and a printer, and feeds a netgear hub for the entertainment area(HTPC/XBox360/Xbox).

When I set up the Asus RT-N66U I put it in the position of the Netgear hub. However this didn't work as the both the Linksys and the Asus want to use the same address. For configuration, I connected the Asus to the HTPC and configured it's network from there by connecting it directly to the modem. Of course this means the rest of the network is out.

A great deal of searching the internet didn't seem to get any help as the term 'and' was translated by Google as 'vs.'

A suggestion sent me to a post where the solution was to change the IP of the wireless router to 192.168.1.2 and to disable DCHP on the wireless router. However, I couldn't see how to disable DCHP on the Asus. Then I switched it and set the Linksys to 192.168.1.2 and ran it off of the Asus, and that didn't work either.

So, then I tried to just set the Asus as an Access Point. That didn't work very well at all, as of course I couldn't find it from my Macs, and the tablet wouldn't connect to it long enough to get the IP number. Running Device Discovery from the PC did not find the Asus.

So, how do I get this to work?

Also, if I should just use something that's an access point, is the RT-N66U overkill, and what would be a appropriate device?

Thank you for your assistance!

SC

ps - Apologies if this is in the wrong section.

 

[jlake]

Hello all,

I've had a wired network for years, and just recently acquired a tablet, so I needed to set up a wired network. Despite using computers since the early 80s, I still consider networking to be black magic, so be gentle please!

The existing network starts with the cable modem and then Cat5 over to a Linksys BEFSR81. From there the Linksys serves the two desktops and a printer, and feeds a netgear hub for the entertainment area(HTPC/XBox360/Xbox).

When I set up the Asus RT-N66U I put it in the position of the Netgear hub. However this didn't work as the both the Linksys and the Asus want to use the same address. For configuration, I connected the Asus to the HTPC and configured it's network from there by connecting it directly to the modem. Of course this means the rest of the network is out.

A great deal of searching the internet didn't seem to get any help as the term 'and' was translated by Google as 'vs.'

A suggestion sent me to a post where the solution was to change the IP of the wireless router to 192.168.1.2 and to disable DCHP on the wireless router. However, I couldn't see how to disable DCHP on the Asus. Then I switched it and set the Linksys to 192.168.1.2 and ran it off of the Asus, and that didn't work either.

So, then I tried to just set the Asus as an Access Point. That didn't work very well at all, as of course I couldn't find it from my Macs, and the tablet wouldn't connect to it long enough to get the IP number. Running Device Discovery from the PC did not find the Asus.

So, how do I get this to work?

Also, if I should just use something that's an access point, is the RT-N66U overkill, and what would be a appropriate device?

Thank you for your assistance!

SC

ps - Apologies if this is in the wrong section.

How would you feel about retiring that linksys BEFsr81? I frequently patronize a business that uses that model, and for me, it's nothing but trouble.

My advice is to go to the Asus website and download the latest firmware for the N66u. Then use the n66u as your main router.

 

[jlake]

Since you're new to wireless routers, here's basic troubleshooting steps.

http://forums.smallnetbuilder.com/showthread.php?t=12453

 

[Nerre]

Also, if I should just use something that's an access point, is the RT-N66U overkill, and what would be a appropriate device?

The RT-N66U is probably overkill for an access point. What most people today call "a wireless router" is generally: a router+a switch+an access point.

I think this might be a suitable topic to re-use a diagram I've made.

You should also try to get some basic understanding of ip networks (stuff like subnet and netmask).

 

[Smithcraft]

How would you feel about retiring that linksys BEFsr81? I frequently patronize a business that uses that model, and for me, it's nothing but trouble.

My advice is to go to the Asus website and download the latest firmware for the N66u. Then use the n66u as your main router.

With regards to retiring the BEFSR81, part of the network that it serves is in a different area and those computers are best served by a wired network. In fact the wireless card in the main desktop is dying and can't be relied upon, and a wireless system would have to be added to the workstation. Also the N66U does not have enough enet sockets for the devices as well as I don't want to run all the enet from where the N66U is to where the devices are.

I've already downloaded and installed the most recent firmware.

Since you're new to wireless routers, here's basic troubleshooting steps.

http://forums.smallnetbuilder.com/showthread.php?t=12453

Basic troubleshooting steps are:

1. Update the firmware
2. After the firmware update, reset the router to factory defaults
3. Reconfigure the router from scratch
4. Remove all of your old wireless profiles from computers, phones, etc
5. Make sure 2.4 Ghz and 5 Ghz have unique SSIDs
6. For 2.4 Ghz, change the channel width to "20 Mhz"
7. Change the 2.4 Ghz channel with the help of inSSIDer
8. If you have cascaded your Asus router to another router, make sure it is not double natting on the same subnet. (Change the Asus IP address to something like 192.168.9.1) or use AP mode instead.

http://kb.linksys.com/Linksys/GetAr...less_Network_Profiles_.xml&pid=80&converted=0

http://www.cultofmac.com/143029/how-to-forget-a-wi-fi-network-on-your-ios-device-ios-tip/

http://www.metageek.net/products/inssider/

1. Already done.
2. Did it numerous times.
3. Did it numerous times.
4. N/A
5. N/A
6. N/A
7. Tired and still can't get both networks to work at the same time. It's either one or the other.

The RT-N66U is probably overkill for an access point. What most people today call "a wireless router" is generally: a router+a switch+an access point.

I think this might be a suitable topic to re-use a diagram I've made.

You should also try to get some basic understanding of ip networks (stuff like subnet and netmask).

Thank you for the diagram.

SC

 

[jlake]

Ok. Try AP mode again on asus. But this time configure it manually instead of automatically.

If your linksys has a local address of 192.168.1.1 then use these settings on Asus:

IP address: 192.168.1.2
Subnet mask 255.255.255.0
Default gateway: 192.168.1.1
DNS:192:168.1.1
DNS: 8.8.8.8

Try configuring Asus before connecting to your linksys.

Then connect to the Asus' internet port (WAN port). I've never had any problems with configuring an Asus for AP mode.

 

[azazel1024]

Also ensure that the IP address for the Asus router/access point is set to something that the Linksys will not assign! That could be why you are having difficulties.

No using the Asus WAN port, you connect a LAN port to your network from the Asus.

 

[Smithcraft]

Looks like that was the way to do it jlake!

Thank you for your assistance!

SC

 

[jlake]

Looks like that was the way to do it jlake!

Thank you for your assistance!

SC

Good deal. Glad you got it working.

It's perfectly fine to use WAN port (internet port) on an Asus router when it's in AP mode. I use WAN port when in AP mode. Asus says use WAN port when in AP mode.

Just like on any forum, you have to sort through fact vs fiction and myth.

 

[stevech]

Good deal. Glad you got it working.

It's perfectly fine to use WAN port (internet port) on an Asus router when it's in AP mode. I use WAN port when in AP mode. Asus says use WAN port when in AP mode.

Just like on any forum, you have to sort through fact vs fiction and myth.

Some but not all dual purpose Router/AP do not support LAN on WAN port when in AP mode. At the least, the device should be clearly marked as in AP mode, its admin LAN IP address should be static and marked, and the WAN port should be marked as LAN not WAN.

 

[jlake]

Some but not all dual purpose Router/AP do not support LAN on WAN port when in AP mode. At the least, the device should be clearly marked as in AP mode, its admin LAN IP address should be static and marked, and the WAN port should be marked as LAN not WAN.

Unfortunately what you're saying is not entirely accurate. Linksys has an AP mode on most of their newer routers running stock firmware. But they don't call it "AP Mode", they call it "bridge mode". It's the same thing as Asus' AP mode. You cascade it LAN to WAN.

Perhaps it would be better if people giving advice on cascading routers were familiar with the device in question rather than posting generic outdated false info.

 

[stevech]

Unfortunately what you're saying is not entirely accurate. Linksys has an AP mode on most of their newer routers running stock firmware. But they don't call it "AP Mode", they call it "bridge mode". It's the same thing as Asus' AP mode. You cascade it LAN to WAN.

Perhaps it would be better if people giving advice on cascading routers were familiar with the device in question rather than posting generic outdated false info.

An access point (AP) in WiFi historically and by convention has no wired IEEE 802.3 (ethernet) ports for user access - only a single Ethernet port to connect the AP to the LAN.
A WiFi bridge by convention often has both AP functions and a built-in switch to permit user devices to connect by 802.3 to the device.

The terminology is confusing and fuzzy among different vendors

Here's D-link talking about this - in last two paragraphs.
http://blog.dlink.com/the-difference-between-bridges-and-access-points/

In general networking (not necessarily WiFi) bridges connect two packet networks, sometimes where one network does not use the same protocol stack as the other (e.g., one is TCP/IP based and not the other). This goes back a long way, i.e., to TCP/IP bridged to SNA networks.

WiFi bridges, a.k.a. Game Adaptors, are usually a client bridge and don't have an access point function. Cisco Aironet did have/has a bridge/AP all in one, to access wired clients and would accept WiFi clinet associations and, this is the hard part, simultaneously be a client of a WiF network. Cradlepoint, Peplink and a few others have this - called "WiFi as WAN".

 

[jlake]

An access point (AP) in WiFi historically and by convention has no wired IEEE 802.3 (ethernet) ports for user access - only a single Ethernet port to connect the AP to the LAN.
A WiFi bridge by convention often has both AP functions and a built-in switch to permit user devices to connect by 802.3 to the device.

The terminology is confusing and fuzzy among different vendors

Here's D-link talking about this - in last two paragraphs.
http://blog.dlink.com/the-difference-between-bridges-and-access-points/

In general networking (not necessarily WiFi) bridges connect two packet networks, sometimes where one network does not use the same protocol stack as the other (e.g., one is TCP/IP based and not the other). This goes back a long way, i.e., to TCP/IP bridged to SNA networks.

WiFi bridges, a.k.a. Game Adaptors, are usually a client bridge and don't have an access point function. Cisco Aironet did have/has a bridge/AP all in one, to access wired clients and would accept WiFi clinet associations and, this is the hard part, simultaneously be a client of a WiF network. Cradlepoint, Peplink and a few others have this - called "WiFi as WAN".

Yes, linksys routers have what's called "bridge mode". And you don't understand it. I get that. Perhaps you should consider contacting Linksys and get them to explain it to you rather than posting false information. And you cascade LAN to WAN. It has essentially replaced the LAN to LAN cascade.

Same with ASUS routers in AP mode. You don't understand why you can use the WAN port on an ASUS router in AP mode and have posted false information to hundreds of people telling them they can't cascade LAN to WAN on an ASuS router in AP mode. I get that. Again, perhaps you should contact Asus and have them explain it to you rather than insisting on posting false information.

 

[thiggins]

Enough, you two. Points made.