Advice for planning network config at new townhouse

[tombet]

I will be moving into a new townhome (new construction) and am trying to decide how I should best configure and place my network equipment before the cable guy comes out to install cable modem service. (Internet only. Not TV, at least at first.)

The townhome is 2160 sq ft, but right in city where real estate is scarce, so its pretty vertical: It has 3 floors, plus a rooftop deck where I will want WiFi too, so effectively its 4 floors.

There is an access panel cabinet in the garage from which there is coax to a few rooms for CATV (I don’t know if it’s RG5 or RG6.) There are also five Cat-5e cable run to multiple rooms from that access panel. (The cables don’t have ends – I’ll have to get a kit for that, unless maybe the cable guy will do it
The builder showed me the access panel with its small cabinet, which has an electrical outlet and some room, and said “Your modem & router will go here.” But I’m not at all sure that’s the smart option. It seems to me I have two general options.

1.) The builders idea of putting the modem and router in the panel. I could then run the Cat5e from there easily. This is a very poor place for a wireless router – in garage on lowest level stuck in a cabinet - so I could just use a wired router here. Then I can put a wireless access point on my main living area on the second floor. With luck, the WiFi signal will go both up and down a floor so effectively the whole house (though the roof is questionable.) One reason I am not wild about this is that if I ever need to reboot the router or the cable modem, I have to go down to the garage, and remove the panel (which requires a screwdriver, though I could probably get thumbscrews.)

2.) I was instead thinking of having the internet cable modem wiring right near my other AV equipment in the 2nd floor living area. Have my Wireless Router right there. Use one of the Cat5e cables from the WiFi Router LAN port to go back down to that access panel in the garage. There I would just have an Ethernet switch (gigabit) so that my pre-wired Cat5e cables to the rest of the house still work. I can easily look at the lights on my router & modem, and easily reboot if necessary. Pretty rare I’d need to reboot the Ethernet switch in the access panel.

Of these two options, what are your thoughts ? Is there yet some other option I have not considered?

If I find I need more than one Access point, can someone also confirm my understanding of a couple points about having both a router and another one or even two Access Points. Even if the devices are sold as WiFi Routers, almost all can function as just an Access Point these days. If I had two such devices, I configure one to be the Router, and one to be an Access Point. I would use the SAME SSID, but configure for different radio channels. Clients should be able to roam thru the house and seamlessly be connected where the signal is strongest. All true ?

I really appreciate any advice around this. Thank you.

 

[o2fst4uo]

What's your budget?

 

[Hawk]

Are you planning to have 2.4 GHZ and 5.0 GHZ specturm available in whole house. Also I have similar situation regarding house, except mine is 3600 sq ft and 5 story.

If you can let me know, I can tell how I have set up mine.

 

[tombet]

As to budget, I was not envisioning it costing more than what it would cost for a couple decent home routers and a switch. Maybe a couple hundred bucks total. That said, I would spend more if doing so would make a significant improvement. I don't see budget being a big issue.

I do intend to use dual band. But its not that critical to mean that I have 5ghz everywhere. If I just had that in the main living area, and only 2.4 stretched to corners and roof, but was still decent, I'd be very satisfied.

So, any thoughts / advice ? Five story, 3600 sq ft house is quite the house. What did you do ?

 

[stevech]

that size, you'll need a WiFi router, perhaps in an office where the internet modem will be.

From there, a home run to a panel, usually in the garage or MBR or a service closet middle of house. Home run from there with cat5 to most other rooms.
Some of those rooms will need an access point. For that size, I'd guess 3-4 accesses, one being the WiFi router.
Access points can be $40 11n-600 or engenious brand access points that look like smoke detectors.

Some people here may encourage you to go all out and build 802.11ac access points and all. Nice if you have the NEED and the bux.

 

[Hawk]

@tombet

Do you have basement in new house? If so do you need coverage over there as well?

 

[AdvHomeServer]

If I were in your place and if my budget supported it, I would plan for what might exist in a few years as opposed what will probably exist in a couple of months.

I would consider dual coax throughout the house. Possibly, one could be for Dish and the other may be for internet or some yet to be defined purpose.

I would also add wired network outlets throughout the house. You might as well go with cat 6 to future proof it. Then you can add wireless access points where needed easily plus have reliable media off the internet.

If you like music, you might add some banana plug style speaker outlets throughout the house from a central point. The outlet is cheaper than the speaker and not unsightly.

If in doubt, add an outlet.

 

[thiggins]

Option 2 will work fine. Switches don't need rebooting.

As long as you have Ethernet drops on each floor, you should get sufficient coverage. Locate drops as centrally on each floor as you can.

Get dual band routers and convert them to APs. Use 5 GHz where possible to avoid network congestion on 2.4.

http://www.smallnetbuilder.com/wire...onvert-a-wireless-router-into-an-access-point

http://www.smallnetbuilder.com/wire...w-to-add-an-access-point-to-a-wireless-router

 

[tombet]

Thank you. It seems at least that my thought process is on the right track. To be clear, the place is built and the ethernet wires are run already - I had no input on those. At least initially, I intend to use the existing wiring, even though I'd have preferred a more thorough job.

 

[tombet]

Could someone also confirm or clarify my question about using one or more Access Points in addition to my Router. Is the following true ?

Even if the devices are sold as WiFi Routers, almost all can function as just an Access Point these days. If I had two such devices, I configure one to be the Router, and one (or more) to be an Access Point. I would use the SAME SSID, on all devices but configure each for different radio channels. (or just leave channel for Auto on all.) Clients should be able to roam thru the house and seamlessly be connected where the signal is strongest. All true ?

 

[ChristineBCW]

(As for inconvenient router-locations, I have our router's Cat5e run to its very handy, central location, then I have Cat5e'd back to the wiring closet's Switch, which feeds all other Cat5e devices - access points.)

Are the rooms all Cat5'd? We did dual-wire pulls but when I run into single-pulls, I can tie (well, duct tape) two more cables to one end, yank it thru and now it's a dual-pull.

And if you've got TV-cable coax to rooms, this is a good time to study MoCA issues, splitters, and even HomePlug/Powerlines for your electricals.

 

[tombet]

I think the cables are all cat5E. Single cables to each room. I didn't have any input on the cabling - it was all done before my purchase. I'm going to try to make it work with the existing cabling, at least for now.

I appreciate the response and comment that you've run the ethernet back to the inconvenient access panel location, and then put a switch there. That's pretty much what I was thinking, and was just looking for confirmation this seems like a good plan.

I'm still hoping to hear confirmation that my understanding of how to properly configure additional access points (beyond the router) is correct. Single SSID ?

Thanks.

 

[ChristineBCW]

My choice of SSIDs was to start with different ones as if to test segregated security. It ended up being a moot point in our residence, so all of ours are the same SSID now. I experimented a bit, though.

I am comfortable doing RJ-45 crimpings on Cat5-6 cabling. I have a punchdown tool, too. But I don't have the trustworthy testing tools other than a notebook to connect in, see if I get out and "domini domini" Blessed Be Thy Connectors. There are good diagrams on the web for Cat 5-5e-6 RJ-45 crimping and punchdowns.

But Hubby's still a nuisance - getting him to chew off just the right amount of cable-housing without biting thru those copper wires... well, he still has some training to endure.

 

[TonyH]

Hi,
Like I always said, draw your idea on a piece of paper as many as you need and visualize. Trying to figure out every thing in your brain is too much to remember every thing. That is what I do professionally or at home.

 

[Hawk]

If I find I need more than one Access point, can someone also confirm my understanding of a couple points about having both a router and another one or even two Access Points. Even if the devices are sold as WiFi Routers, almost all can function as just an Access Point these days. If I had two such devices, I configure one to be the Router, and one to be an Access Point. I would use the SAME SSID, but configure for different radio channels. Clients should be able to roam thru the house and seamlessly be connected where the signal is strongest. All true ?

I really appreciate any advice around this. Thank you.

It really depends on individual clients whether they want to roam or not. Example I have two rt-ac68u connected via cat 6 cable, all android devices can roam between access points without issues. However my aging laptop doesn’t do it. One you see in office or similar place is controlled by controller which does seamless roaming for clients, but these cost fortunate.

If possible go with cat 6 cable instead of 5e, price wise there is not much difference but cat 6 has better immunity to noise.

 

[stevech]

Yes, any WiFi router can be reconfigured as an Access Point.
But $25 things like this have a purposeful AP mode and that's much better.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16833320168&cm_re=rt-n12-_-33-320-168-_-Product

Fry's has better prices on this - like $25. It's not N600 but you can change someday later. Mobile devices don't need N600 as a rule.

 

[fistv]

I would pick a small closet or enclosed wall area about 2ft deep, 2ft wide, 4ft high that has power, two or four outlets on it's own breaker, run your internet coax cable to there. In that I would put a wall mounted rack like this, http://www.amazon.com/dp/B0041W55YE/?tag=snbforums-20 that would be where you network ports to the other rooms and floors would be as well as your cable modem router, UPS and a network switch, you could also mount direct tv or dish boxes in there on shelves made for those racks as well and use an IR blaster. The other thing if you can is have conduit installed where you might want it and pull strings installed, capped for future use for pulling any other cable that comes along. I never run a single network drop, I always run a minimum of two. I've been trying to get time to run 5 drops to my entertainment center so I can pull the switch out that is in there now.

I do not like those home type levitron boxes where everything gets stuffed into a neat designer box.

 

[fistv]

My choice of SSIDs was to start with different ones as if to test segregated security. It ended up being a moot point in our residence, so all of ours are the same SSID now. I experimented a bit, though.

I am comfortable doing RJ-45 crimpings on Cat5-6 cabling. I have a punchdown tool, too. But I don't have the trustworthy testing tools other than a notebook to connect in, see if I get out and "domini domini" Blessed Be Thy Connectors. There are good diagrams on the web for Cat 5-5e-6 RJ-45 crimping and punchdowns.

But Hubby's still a nuisance - getting him to chew off just the right amount of cable-housing without biting thru those copper wires... well, he still has some training to endure.

Don't use RJ 45's crimping them on, use keystone jacks to rack mounted and at the wall outlets use a keystone jack to an outlet cover, snaps right in, they also make pass throughs for coax that also snap in , when I see a rj45 jack coming out of a wall I know I"m going to be spending time fixing them. The wire that goes in walls is not meant to be bent over and over as things get moved around, that is what patch cable is for, wall cable is solid conductor and not made to flex, patch cable is made to flex.

 

[ChristineBCW]

You see made-up cables from wall outlets? Why?

Not me. That's why "punch down tool" is mentioned in the first place. Crimpers are for patches.

 

[fistv]

You see made-up cables from wall outlets? Why?

Not me. That's why "punch down tool" is mentioned in the first place. Crimpers are for patches.

Must have misread. Quite a few homeowners that put network cable in go to HD and get a roll or two of cable, tips and crimper and whatever else the sales person can sell them. Then they go home and try to figure it out, running the cable, crimping on a tip and then realizing they cut it 3 inches too short.
Most of the 110 patch panels are labeled on the back as 568B, the keystone rj45 jacks are labeled for both A and B as well as having F type Coax keystones, HDMI keystones, BNC keystones, audio keystones that fit in the wall plates, makes for a neater install.
My local Radio Shack will loan you a cable tester if you buy your materials from them for free, small charge and security deposit if you just walk in looking for one to borrow. But then he's the only place within 30 miles from where I live that sells that kind of stuff.