Asus-Merlin FW vs Tomato or DD-WRT for RT-AC66 or RTAC68 Routers

[Just Checking]

I have a couple RT-AC66R routers running Asus-Merlin FW ver 374.40 final. I'd like to thank Merlin for the excellent job he has done to work out many bugs in the stock FW and incorporate other features while being sure to keep the reliability as the primary objective.

I have been following the thread at
http://www.linksysinfo.org/index.php?threads/tomato-builds-for-asus-rt-ac66u.68055/page-4

This thread has detailed the advancements made in the Tomato Shibby FW build for the RT-AC66 router.

I am also aware of the DD-WRT Kong build for the RT-AC66 router.

My question is as follows:
Given the current states of FW development for the Asus-Merlin, Tomato Shibby, and DD-WRT Kong builds, what do forum members think are the main pros/cons for each of the respective FW builds? I would preffer to have feedback from members who have actually installed and tried those FW rather than just have hearsay comments.

I have experience with the stock Asus FW and recent experience with the Asus-Merlin FW. I have limited experience with Tomato Shibby FW on other router platforms and none at all on the DD-WRT Kong build. I liked many of the features that I have heard about but am concerned about stability, throughput, and installation difficulty for these open source FW alternatives. Installing the Asus-Merlin FW was painless and it has run very stable with only very minor glitches for me.

I am not trying to start some type of war. My intention is to get reasoned experiences from real world users in order to make a better decision which FW to use.

Thanks in advance.

 

[RMerlin]

Personally I always resume it very simply:

I offer performance. DD-WRT offers features. Tomato offers a mix of both.

 

[Just Checking]

Personally I always resume it very simply:

I offer performance. DD-WRT offers features. Tomato offers a mix of both.

Merlin,
Thanks again for providing a stable upgrade to the standard Asus FW. I certainly like it better than the stock firmware which I thought was the best OEM firmware of all the router manufacturers. I also appreciate your analysis of the different options. I was hoping to get a little more detail to fill things out.

Some examples of this are as follows:
1. The forums seem to indicate that there is a wireless speed hit by using Tomato or DD-WRT FW. Has there been any actual measurements to quantify the difference, if any? Tim Higgins does a lot of work to do controlled tests of uplink and downlink speed wrt to antenna orientation and signal strength. He clearly states the FW build because that can make a difference. I have never seen those kind of numbers to compare the Asus-Merlin to Tomato-Shibby to DD-WRT-Kong.

2. I am interested in the Open VPN implementation. Performance is dependent on both router nt CPU/hardware and Firmware. Has anyone measured performance with the different FW on the same router platform?

3. FTP server implementation is dependent on hardware and firmware. Has anyone measured the differences?

4. Loading the firmware into the router can be challenging. Flashing the Asus-Merlin FW was no more difficult than updating the stock Asus firmware. Loading Tomato-Shibby (from what I have read in that forum) is a hit or miss proposition which may require multiple nvram clearances, reboots, flashing DD-WRT Firmware first then the Tomato-Shibby build. What have other users experienced with the DD-WRT Kong FW?

5. What about security, QOS implementation, double NAT, DMZ, port forwarding, PPPOe implementation, and the whole host of other features that I have not mentioned?

I am interested in finding out what other users do with those "other features" in the first place, why they want them, and which FW do they think does it best. It gives me different viewpoints and ideas for things to try.

 

[dmarl27]

Feedback

FWIW- I can't speak to the Shibby / DD-WRT on Asus but prior to my Asus router purchase, I had a Linksys WRT54GS v1.1 if I recall correctly.

I ran DD-WRT on it for some time but finally got fed of up with their code quality - there were new beta builds coming out every day. It seemed like there was a lot of bug regressions and multiple builds to pick through (Brainslayers, ekos, etc.)

I switched to Tomato and was very happy with it.

I ended up buying an Asus after the Linksys died - which was good since it started to be a bottleneck as Comcast kept raising their speeds.

Shortly after the Asus purchase, I switched to Merlin's releases. I enjoy his perspective - simple and clean. I don't use a lot of the advanced features (VPN, torrent client) but for the most part everything's been fine.

 

[test011]

In case of Openwrt, IGMP Snooping is broken in many models, because the feature is related to switch manufacturer specific drivers - or their bugs. You can hardly use Openwrt'ed router without multicast packet flooding which resulted in Openwrt's inferiority to stock firmwares in some IPTV environment. But still super rich features.

I imagine it's a similar situation.

It is my understanding that Hardware acceleration can only be enabled in Asuswrt stock/Merlin and not in the others. You probably get less than a half, more likely a quarter, of what you get with HW acceleration. I wonder whether there is any other performance factor.

 

[KGB7]

If i remember correctly, you dont need HW Acceleration up to 500mbps.

Every firmware uses same Broadcom drivers, so if you are having issues with WiFi or lan speeds, then blame Broadcom for their poor drivers.

At the end of the day, you need to chose firmware based on features and stability.
Kong (dd-wrt) has been doing a good job with his firmware, fixing issues as soon as they are found.
Tomato is still new on AC68, some people like my self cant even get it to work, so its still in early Beta stages.
Merlin firmware is good, but lacks features that other firmwares offer.

 

[test011]

If i remember correctly, you dont need HW Acceleration up to 500mbps.

Every firmware uses same Broadcom drivers, so if you are having issues with WiFi or lan speeds, then blame Broadcom for their poor drivers.

At the end of the day, you need to chose firmware based on features and stability.
Kong (dd-wrt) has been doing a good job with his firmware, fixing issues as soon as they are found.
Tomato is still new on AC68, some people like my self cant even get it to work, so its still in early Beta stages.
Merlin firmware is good, but lacks features that other firmwares offer.

If HW acceleration is off the table, the next stock/Merlin only feature is IGMP Snooping for IPTV. I think It is currently also broken with Asuswrt though. It may be fixed eventually. But I doubt the others have a 3rd party way of supporting it. (a workaround is separate VLAN)

 

[bhall7]

I used to use Toastman's Tomato firmware builds for my ASUS RT-N16, but since I got my ASUS RT-AC66U, I've been using Asuswrt-Merlin. I've been very pleased with the performance, but I miss some features that Tomato offers.

I wish there was a "Web Usage" feature in Asuswrt-Merlin like Tomato has. This would be my preferred feature to add in Asuswrt-Merlin, if there were a feature request list.

Overall, though, I've been really happy with Asuswrt-Merlin.

I think Shibby's Tomato builds are getting to the point now where I am ready to do some extensive performance testing and compare the two on the ASUS RT-AC66U.

 

[Just Checking]

If i remember correctly, you dont need HW Acceleration up to 500mbps.

Every firmware uses same Broadcom drivers, so if you are having issues with WiFi or lan speeds, then blame Broadcom for their poor drivers.

I do not agree that the Broadcom drivers are the determining factor in LAN speeds. If it were only the drivers that affected wireless and LAN transfer speeds then all routers with the same chipset would have no performance difference and Tim Higgins would only have to test one router per chipset.

My direct experience indicates that there are many hardware and firmware factors that affect actual wireless radio performance. Depending on your definition of LAN, hardware and firmware also can have a significant role in the real world performance of the router.

 

[Pierino]

Since no one responded to the question regarding ease/difficulty in loading dd-wrt, I'll give it a shot.
I have an ac68u, n66u and ac66u. I never ever have had trouble loading dd-wrt onto any of them. I just flash the appropriate .trx trailed build using the GUI.
Some put the routers in recovery mode but I've never had to.to flash back to stock/Merlin, I change the .trx to .bin and flash it back through the dd-wrt GUI.

 

[connorm]

over the last 2-3 months ive been converted into a tomato fanboy. i have been happily using Tomato Shibby 1.28 on my RT-AC66U for months now and it is rock solid.

if you like good WIFI, QOS, and USB NAS performance Tomato Shibby Makes a great choice. the only thing i can think to say negative about it is the first time u install it getting the 5ghz radio working is a little bit of a trick, but not very hard, and there is a video guide made by shibby on how to do it. for me tomato is amazing it has everything i need and more.

the only reason i wouldnt recommend shibby 1.28 is if your connection is 170mbit+ like a high speed fiber connection or a very highspeed cable connection. if you want to handle those speeds you NEED HW acceleration which is only in merlins firmware or the stock asus firmware

 

[SVettel]

On AC68U, with HW Acceleration off. Performance-wise, now WIP Tomato-Arm is better( or much better) than ASUSWrt(-Merlin).

With 100Mpbs WAN speed, with per-ip traffic turned off, Merlin's ate 47% CPU, while per-ip traffic turned on, ate 53% CPU, while Tomato-Arm only ate 41% under same circumstance, which is a huge difference when per-ip traffic is turned on (Note that 41% vs 53% is not merely of 12% difference, but of 22%--30% performance difference provided the frame of reference is either one).

Refer to:
http://linksysinfo.org/index.php?goto/post&id=242707#post-242707

 

[L&LD]

While you're mathematically correct with your percentage differences, as long as this is the only load on the cpu (and only when traffic is high, I assume) and you're staying lower than ~80%, the point is moot.

Yes, a little more power used, but other than that, there is no real difference.

 

[RMerlin]

On AC68U, with HW Acceleration off. Performance-wise, now WIP Tomato-Arm is better( or much better) than ASUSWrt(-Merlin).

With 100Mpbs WAN speed, with per-ip traffic turned off, Merlin's ate 47% CPU, while per-ip traffic turned on, ate 53% CPU, while Tomato-Arm only ate 41% under same circumstance, which is a huge difference when per-ip traffic is turned on (Note that 41% vs 53% is not merely of 12% difference, but of 22%--30% performance difference provided the frame of reference is either one).

Refer to:
http://linksysinfo.org/index.php?goto/post&id=242707#post-242707

Tomato's IPTraffic is missing a few firewall rules, which will cause it to miss traffic sent through VPN tunnels (for example). That would account in part for the CPU load difference when using IPTraffic.

 

[connorm]

While you're mathematically correct with your percentage differences, as long as this is the only load on the cpu (and only when traffic is high, I assume) and you're staying lower than ~80%, the point is moot.

Yes, a little more power used, but other than that, there is no real difference.

ive noticed performance gains in almost every department, im curious which area's you believe merlin-wrt could outperform tomato, if any

of course i mean with HW acceleration off. although with it on the only real gain is wan-lan throughput.

the only real difference is the gui and really small stuff imo. there are some cool things about merlin-wrt and there are some cool things bout tomato shibby.

 

[test011]

In my town, the minimum internet speed contract is 100Mbps. 150Mbps cable is very common too. With FullHD (not just HD) IPTV multicating packets hitting CPU continuously, I am not sure how long HW acceleration can be ditched.

Can't Asus open up the HW acceleration driver?
I know QOS will turn off HW accelerrarion, will VLAN also turn off it?

 

[mromero]

I've used all three.

DDWRT by Brainslayer is great and stable and is now provided commercially on select Buffalo routers. It has been at least a year since I used DDWRT but I really like the firmware and may buy a Buffalo just to have DDWRT on it.

Tomato is the best of the lot in terms of capability, features and performance primarily because of its robust QOS features which work great with their default settings and easy to configure.

Merlin is the best for a stable and very conservative firmware. For me the big letdown is the reluctance to upgrade the primitive QOS Asus supplies.

Merlin also has a big advantage in the way the firmware is provided with a logical and well-laid out download service. Everything is well organized, labeled, commented and the gentleman is busy in the forums. In short, very professional.

Tomato I just cannot grasp what is what and where in the download services and the slew of varying versions by different people make it attractive only to hobbyists with a lot of time on their hands.

So Merlin rules overall in my book!

 

[RMerlin]

In my town, the minimum internet speed contract is 100Mbps. 150Mbps cable is very common too. With FullHD (not just HD) IPTV multicating packets hitting CPU continuously, I am not sure how long HW acceleration can be ditched.

Can't Asus open up the HW acceleration driver?
I know QOS will turn off HW accelerrarion, will VLAN also turn off it?

Asus themselves don't even have the source code - only Broadcom does.

 

[Just Checking]

I've used all three.

DDWRT by Brainslayer is great and stable and is now provided commercially on select Buffalo routers. It has been at least a year since I used DDWRT but I really like the firmware and may buy a Buffalo just to have DDWRT on it.

Tomato is the best of the lot in terms of capability, features and performance primarily because of its robust QOS features which work great with their default settings and easy to configure.

Merlin is the best for a stable and very conservative firmware. For me the big letdown is the reluctance to upgrade the primitive QOS Asus supplies.

Merlin also has a big advantage in the way the firmware is provided with a logical and well-laid out download service. Everything is well organized, labeled, commented and the gentleman is busy in the forums. In short, very professional.

Tomato I just cannot grasp what is what and where in the download services and the slew of varying versions by different people make it attractive only to hobbyists with a lot of time on their hands.

So Merlin rules overall in my book!

I have a Buffalo WZR-1750DHP with the latest stock firmware. I abhor the stock firmware and would like to upgrade to something better. Can you provide a website link where I can get the DD-WRT-Brainslayer firmware for the Buffalo router? Also instructions on how to install it? (My apologies that this portion of the post is slightly off topic for the Asus-Merlin FW on Asus routers). Buffalo reps state that installing DD-WRT on the WZR-1750DHP voids any warranty and is not supported. It is also a finicky router to recover if it gets semi-bricked according to a lot of posts.

I am also somewhat confused about the Tomato-Shibby FW. Other posts in this thread and elsewhere refer to using version 1.28. Every search I do seems to indicate that version 1.16 is the latest version for an Asus AC router. Also, despite what a previous poster said, the main Tomato-Shibby post as of 04 April 2014 seems to indicate that people are still having problems implementing the 5GHz AC wireless capabilites which is important to me. The YouTube videos on installing Tomato-Shibby were not as helpful or informative as I would like either. I'd like to install this firmware on one of my Asus RT-AC66R routers but I don't want to brick it just to try to do a comparison.

 

[DrTeeth]

DD-WRT - site very confusing. Many places say different things about the same topic. Sooo many diffent versions/builds .
Tomato - dearth of documentation .
Merlin - tons of advice here; up to date information; no confusion; active, healful and polite programmer .

Guess which choice I made!