Buying a router for better range. Need some suggestions.

[Event_Horizon]

I am thinking about replacing an Asus AC66U router purely to get better range. Someone gave me a new TP Link C2600, but I'm not overly impressed, more so now that I know MU-MIMO is broken with this router, thanks to SMB.
Can anyone recommend a router with better range than the AC66U? I was thinking that the Netgear R7000 AC 1900 might have a better range and throughput at range. But I am open to suggestion.
Cheers.
Greg

 

[sfx2000]

If it's just coverage - try relocating the RT-AC66U a bit..

Physics are what they are - and no router is going to do a blind jump into hyperspace or create a cone of silence. Can't unbend the rules of the universe...

 

[Event_Horizon]

Not trying to change the laws of physics, just trying to get a better throughput at higher attenuation. My router is already centrally placed, so no real benefit to moving it again. Thanks for the laugh, a cone of silence would come in handy at times.....

 

[pete y testing]

I was thinking that the Netgear R7000 AC 1900 might have a better range and throughput at range.

he is some real world testing for you

24 meters away other end of house Location E
see house layout at top of this thread

2.4 GIG ch 1

dlink dir-880L read 8.05 write 9.2 sync 243M
tp link archer c9 read 8.5 write 8.7 sync 216M
asus rt-ac87u read 6.8 write 11.5 sync 324M
dlink dsl-2900al read 5.7 write 6.75 sync 162M
tp link archer D9 read 8.1 write 8.5 sync 216M
dlink dir-890L read 5.92 write 8.7M sync 173M ( no ability to disable obss coexistance)
asus rt-ac68u read 5.32 write 8.32 sync 243M
asus dsl-ac68u read 9.45 write 10.6 sync 216M
netgear r7000 read 13.2 write 11.9 sync 270M
fritzbox 7490 read write sync 108M failed to complete transfer in ether direction
asus rt-ac3200 read 9.5write 7.2 sync 81.5M
synology rt1900ac read 1.96MB/s write 1.88MB/s

netgear wndr 3800 read 5.84 write 4.2M sync 130M

5 gig lower band ch 44 ( 3200ac models )

dlink dir-890L read 7.75 write 6.08 sync 87.5M

asus rt-ac3200 read 7.5 write 6 sync 87.5M

fritzbox 7490 read 10.5 write 6.45 sync 58.5M ( does not have upper channel selection )

5 gig upper band ch 153

dlink dir-880L read 21.1 write 15.5 sync 234M
tp link archer c9 read 20.5 write 15.8 sync 175M
asus rt-ac87u read 14.3 write 12.6 sync 175.5M
dlink dsl-2900al read 19.9 write 17.5 sync 263M
tp link archer D9 read 15.2 write 9.4 sync 117M
dlink dir-890L read 19.3 write 15.1 sync 175.5M
asus rt-ac68u read 15.6 write 17.5 sync 234M
asus dsl-ac68u read 21.9 write 14.8 sync 175M
netgear r7000 read 21.0 write 17.4 sync 234M
asus rt-ac3200 read 14.5 write sync 117M
synology rt1900ac read 1.77MB/s write 4.27MB/s

netgear wndr 3800 read 1.3 write 1.29 sync 270M

see link below for location info , location A is where my test point is

https://onedrive.live.com/?cid=7D5C...1a0742!812&parId=7D5CB240BE1A0742!144&o=OneUp

so as you can see the netgear is not really any better than some others

more so now that I know MU-MIMO is broken

and its pretty irrelevant atm as none of us have mu-mimo clients to take advantage of it anyway

 

[System Error Message]

some wifi routers have different range, its all to do with design, chips used and antenna used. The range however dont vary by much so even though 1 wifi router may have more range than another it wouldnt be by much. Placement is very important and whether MU-MIMO works or not doesnt matter because this is a question of range.

Taking asus into example the AC68U has more range than the AC66 and the AC3200 has a bit more range than the AC68U. This is for non-MU-MIMO routers.

 

[Event_Horizon]

I actually have 3 MuMimo clients currently, the Nexus 6p, Nexus 5X and a new Acer V15 Nitro. Obviously a moot point as the TP-Link C2600's MuMimo is broken. Perhaps I should just go back to my Asus AC66U if range is all the same. I guess there are limitations to 2.4 and 5.0ghz that have resulted in no range improvements since AC 1750?

 

[RMinNJ]

I actually have 3 MuMimo clients currently, the Nexus 6p, Nexus 5X and a new Acer V15 Nitro. Obviously a moot point as the TP-Link C2600's MuMimo is broken. Perhaps I should just go back to my Asus AC66U if range is all the same. I guess there are limitations to 2.4 and 5.0ghz that have resulted in no range improvements since AC 1750?

Right, according to the SNB MU-MIMO second tests the Netgear 7800 seemed to be the only one that worked correctly. Its almost like you need to make sure your clients and router are certified and tested to
work with each other ? Maybe TP-Link will come out with a fix when they see the test?

 

[pete y testing]

I actually have 3 MuMimo clients currently, the Nexus 6p, Nexus 5X and a new Acer V15 Nitro.

lucky you but as you have see mu-mimo isnt the panacea its claimed to be and alnost non of the routers so far work well with mu-mimo

Perhaps I should just go back to my Asus AC66U if range is all the same. I guess there are limitations to 2.4 and 5.0ghz that have resulted in no range improvements since AC 1750?

the fact it is 1750 has little to do with its coverage and range

manufactures are limited by law to how much power any wifi radio is allowed to transmit and they can not exceed it , however new beam forming has help with black spots etc in the way it works but you cant expect any wifi radio to defeat environmental conditions and manufacturing materials with the same power levels

we have come well past the days of expecting any single wifi transmission to give us the coverage and throughput we desire and the use of a second or multiple ap's is a far better option located in areas to guarantee great coveragein allareas of the house or building you are using them in

 

[Screwdriver]

I had a RT-AC66U and had a dead area where 2.4 was really spotty and 5ghz was non existent. I bought a RT-AC87 but had issues with the 5ghz, but 2.4 was great. I returned it and got the RT-AC3200 on sale and it took care of my issues. My whole house now gets coverage on both bands. The RT-AC3200 sits in the same spot the RT-AC66U sat...

 

[thiggins]

Use the Router Charts, select 5 GHz Downlink profile benchmark, latest test method (magenta bar color). Change view from default Average to 36dB.

This link will get you to most of the way to the correct view.
http://www.smallnetbuilder.com/tools/charts/router/bar/119-5-ghz-profile-dn?see=P_36
Then move to higher attenuations and see how the field narrows.

Higher throughput at high attenuation will provide some idea of relative range.

 

[sfx2000]

Not trying to change the laws of physics, just trying to get a better throughput at higher attenuation. My router is already centrally placed, so no real benefit to moving it again. Thanks for the laugh, a cone of silence would come in handy at times.....

I know it sounds funny, but there a fair amount of solid math behind it - move the router about 6 inches in any direction, and it might be just enough...

(has to do with wavefront fading characteristics in the radio domain).

 

[Rtr8]

Right, according to the SNB MU-MIMO second tests the Netgear 7800 seemed to be the only one that worked correctly. Its almost like you need to make sure your clients and router are certified and tested to
work with each other ? Maybe TP-Link will come out with a fix when they see the test?

I tried checking with TP Link support yesterday. For them C2600 is the best in class yet and it is a 'very powerful' device which should support very large homes.

 

[Rtr8]

Even though you have the new MU-MIMO devices, it would take months for Routers to provide you the performance that you envision. You may be well off by comparing existing router performance to the intended router performance at 36bB attenuation ( as Tim suggested) Is it really the price performaning at that point.

 

[L&LD]

I tried checking with TP Link support yesterday. For them C2600 is the best in class yet and it is a 'very powerful' device which should support very large homes.

Trying to be as gentle as possible here, but I would never ask the opinion from the person/company I was considering purchasing a product from (and then believe it). That is just plain common sense 101, I don't think this needs to be explained further?

The Ranker detail shows stronger 2.4 GHz performance than 5 GHz, mainly due to its higher maximum throughput, which also contributes to its higher average throughput rank. The only #1 rank earned in 5 GHz is actually a tie with the Linksys EA8500, which has an overall #2 rank.

http://www.smallnetbuilder.com/wire...ess-dual-band-gigabit-router-reviewed?start=4

And while the router gets a #1 overall ranking here too, that doesn't mean too much when you look at the details (and limitations) of how a router gets ranked in each class, imo.

Particularly when these rankings are just a point in time comparison that do not (cannot) take other aspects into consideration too that are just as, or, more important than the initial performance the device offered once upon a time.

 

[Trip]

Sometimes there's no substitute for more radios, if the use-case can support it. Is there anything in particular that keeps you from running multiple APs in multiple locations, other than just simply wanting to run everything off one box?

 

[System Error Message]

Trying to be as gentle as possible here, but I would never ask the opinion from the person/company I was considering purchasing a product from (and then believe it). That is just plain common sense 101, I don't think this needs to be explained further?



http://www.smallnetbuilder.com/wire...ess-dual-band-gigabit-router-reviewed?start=4

And while the router gets a #1 overall ranking here too, that doesn't mean too much when you look at the details (and limitations) of how a router gets ranked in each class, imo.

Particularly when these rankings are just a point in time comparison that do not (cannot) take other aspects into consideration too that are just as, or, more important than the initial performance the device offered once upon a time.

Its obvious all companies will say their products are the best. You need to look at facts and tests like what sort of antennas are used, the internal design, the chips used and firmware.
Than theres placement and wall materials used.

 

[RMerlin]

I know it sounds funny, but there a fair amount of solid math behind it - move the router about 6 inches in any direction, and it might be just enough...

Personal anecdotal evidence:

One night, I was doing some basic performance tests between my laptop (while sitting on the couch, with the laptop in my lap, so a bit low) and the router (on the top of the shelves, at the opposite end of the room).

Just changing the inclination of my laptop's screen (where the antennas are located) would have a very measurable effect on benchmarks...

 

[sfx2000]

Sometimes there's no substitute for more radios, if the use-case can support it. Is there anything in particular that keeps you from running multiple APs in multiple locations, other than just simply wanting to run everything off one box?

Erm - no... I'm guessing that you're speaking of the "Smart Connect" devices based on Broadcom for the AC3200/AC5300 class...

From an RF engineering perspective - having two AP's in the same band class right next to each other - hurts the performance of both... just doesn't make sense.

An additional 5GHz AP 10 meters away, yes, that makes sense...

But confirmation bias of the uneducated very well deny this... and I'll likely catch some flack for this comment...