Need High Throughput Router

[djtech2k]

I am an IT guy (not networking guy) and do a lot of work from my house. I have my lab network and my home network all running through 1 internet connection from Comcast (unfortunately). I have been running this network through an Asus RT-N16 wireless router for a couple years. It is running DD-WRT, which I like.

I have multiple Gigabit switches throughout my house. I use the RT-N16 as my "main router" for the house, so all network connectivity to the internet flows through this router and all wifi goes through this router. My lab equipment is all connected to a separate switch so its traffic is more isolated.

It seems that when doing any kind of streaming or anything like that on wifi, then things really slow down. I would like to improve that. Also, I was told that the RT-N16 had gigabit LAN speed, but the wired speed also slows down. My guess is that I may be reaching the limits of the CPU in this device and may need a faster device. I am a network novice, but this is just my guess. I do not have any specific tuning in DD-WRT, only my needed configuration.

Any suggestions for optimizing my RT-N16 or for a replacement that won't have this problem?

 

[train_wreck]

Well the rt-n16 is going on 4 years old, and some of the reviews of it specifically mention wireless/wired confliction issues. Have you ever done a reset of the firmware? Also have you isolated just the router, and done testing without any other switches/devices in the way? As for current routers, the ASUS RT-AC68U and the Netgear R700 i believe are getting good reviews, but are expensive.

My personal recommendation is to re-purpose an old PC for a router. Doesn't need to be high-end, just needs 2 gigabit ethernet ports and a wireless card, and it's a great learning experience. Set up right, it should give you very good performance & congestion management.

 

[stevech]

My personal recommendation is to re-purpose an old PC for a router. Doesn't need to be high-end, just needs 2 gigabit ethernet ports and a wireless card, and it's a great learning experience. Set up right, it should give you very good performance & congestion management.

That's a very odd use case! High work load to build/sustain, and $ to power.

 

[djtech2k]

Thanks.

I see your point on using a box to manage routing, but I have run a TMG box in the past and would rather not have the overhead, plus I really don't have any free hardware lying around right now.

I would prefer to have a device do the work for me.

The RT-N16 seems like a great device and I really like it. Now as my home network and home have grown, I suspect it falls behind because of lack of processing power. I do like using DD-WRT, but I am not dead set on it.

 

[KGB7]

Get a newer router and be done with it.

As an IT guy, you should know this.

 

[djtech2k]

wow, ok. Well I don't know about you, but I just don't go buy a new "black box" whenever things aren't working the way I want. I troubleshoot the issue and fix the problem. Now I am not saying that a 4 year old router is something that I shouldn't replace, but my suspicion is that the router CPU/processing is not keeping up. If that's the case, then I have no idea if a new one is going to fix that.

That's why I am trying to gather info about the abilities of mine or a new one that should definitely outperform mine. I am not going to go buy a random new router and just hope that it works better. If I buy something, then I want to have some confidence that it will work better.

The flexibility and extensibility of DD-WRT has been great.

 

[L&LD]

Then what you should look into is the Asus routers (with RMerlin's firmware and even with the suggested (do a search on this forum for user Sky1111) upgrade to the features we will be able to do with stock firmware even (which RMerlin will improve on too, I'm sure).

To see if your old router is the problem (it is) simply try a newer model. RT-AC68U would be the one I'd be trying at this time.

Doesn't matter what the hardware reasons are that will improve your network performance; all that matters is that it works for you.

With that duck in a row - come back and educate yourself on the nuances of networking.

Sometimes, the theory (hardware specs do not imply performance) is just a guideline. Testing in your actual conditions are what separates the tools from the toys.

 

[djtech2k]

Thanks a lot for the referral.

I did a quick search for sky1111 and there are a ton of threads. I'll try to dig through them when I have more time to read all the threads.

So I see the RT-AC68U comes with something called "ASUSWRT". Is that anything like or related to DD-WRT? Are that RMerlin and Sky1111 custom firmwares or something? I realize that with a lot of work, some things can be tweaked to the n'th degree. I am pretty busy, so I will not be doing super tweaking or daily upgrades. I don't mind standard maintenance or updates as I have updated multiple of my Asus routers with DD-WRT over the years. I just don't want to get into something that takes constant effort to maintain.

So far the reviews and specs on that router look great. I'm just curious about the OS/firmware.

 

[L&LD]

http://forums.smallnetbuilder.com/showthread.php?p=109026#post109026


Sky1111 does not create firmware, but RMerlin does.

http://forums.smallnetbuilder.com/showthread.php?t=7846

 

[djtech2k]

In your opinion, how much of a pain is it to deal with the Rmerlin firmware? Like are there a ton of updates/re-flashes? Is it fairly easy to flash?

The feature list definitely make it look better than the Asus version. Any idea how the RMerlin compares to DD-WRT?

 

[L&LD]

RMerlin firmware is the reason I bought an Asus router in the first place.

Compared to DD-WRT (with all the horror stories and other nightmares I read about before I decided that flashing DD-WRT would be the last thing I do to any of my routers) is like comparing a walk on a sun drenched beach to an exhilarating snowboard adventure which starts with a gentle drop from a 'copter at an altitude of 7000 feet on a mountain peak somewhere.

Sure, the helicopter ride by itself is more exhilarating. But just like with routers and DD-WRT, it can also kill you too.

 

[djtech2k]

Gotcha, thanks.

 

[KGB7]

wow, ok. Well I don't know about you, but I just don't go buy a new "black box" whenever things aren't working the way I want. I troubleshoot the issue and fix the problem. Now I am not saying that a 4 year old router is something that I shouldn't replace, but my suspicion is that the router CPU/processing is not keeping up. If that's the case, then I have no idea if a new one is going to fix that.

That's why I am trying to gather info about the abilities of mine or a new one that should definitely outperform mine. I am not going to go buy a random new router and just hope that it works better. If I buy something, then I want to have some confidence that it will work better.

The flexibility and extensibility of DD-WRT has been great.

Most stores have a 30 day return policy, no shame in returning a product if it doesn't solve an issue. Not all of us have a box of spare parts laying around to test it with. Right??....Right.

We have no access to your home brewed network, there for we cant see it to diagnose the issue successfully, only you can do that, and by the looks of it you have narrowed down the issue to a 4 year old router that is no longer capable of doing its job.

When was the last time you pushed a reset button on your router? You havent mentioned what you have and have not done to trouble shoot your issues. More info helps. Help us to help you.


DD-WRT firmware works fine on AC68 routers. Its not perfect and its continues work in progress, just as any firmware. Ive been using Kong firmware for over a month with very little to no issues. Plus, Kong continues to do a very good job working out the bugs. So all you have to do is post a question in a dedicated thread to AC68 routers and he will get back to you in a timely matter, as well as come out with new firmware.

And if you do get AC68 or R7000 router and you decide to install any flavor of DD-WRT firmware, just remember one thing; the 30/30/30 method no longer works on newer routers.



So as you can see, this is why i gave a very simple answer from the get-go. Plus, in this forum, we tend to recommend Asus routers more often then other brands, simply because of Merlins dedicated support for Asus products.


You also have an option of AC56 router, but you never mentioned how big your house is, or the range of the wifi you require. Since AC56 has internal antennas, thus the range a tad smaller vs AC68 router.

 

[djtech2k]

Well it has been a while, but I am finally ready to buy some new equipment. I figured I would revive this thread instead of starting a new one.

So the last time I was looking, I think the Asus AC68U was the router recommended. Is that still the case or has it changed? As I recall, you guys were talking about using the "merlin" firmware instead of DD-WRT also.

Can you guys "refresh" your suggestion on the router and firmware that you would get now? As mentioned before, My Asus RT-N16 has been good, but I need better wifi coverage and more overall speed when streaming across my network. I have Gig switches running throughout my house but everything runs through this router.

Thanks!

 

[microchip]

In your opinion, how much of a pain is it to deal with the Rmerlin firmware? Like are there a ton of updates/re-flashes? Is it fairly easy to flash?

The feature list definitely make it look better than the Asus version. Any idea how the RMerlin compares to DD-WRT?

RMerlin's FW is basically stock ASUS FW with fixes and improvements added. DD-WRT is more "advanced" and can't easily be compared by RMerlin's one. Flashing of RMerlin's FW is very easy. It's done the same way as flashing the standard ASUS FW. When a new version of RMerlin's FW is out, he usually announces it and makes a thread in the RMerlin subforum

 

[djtech2k]

Is Linux exposed via ssh with Merlin's? I ask because I have some configuration in Linux and with the scheduled scripts feature of DD-WRT that I may need to keep using. For example, I have a script to workaround a DNS issue in DD-WRT and some iptables commands for firewall blocking.

If it gives me the features/flexibility, then I am all for using Merlin or whatever.

What about the router models? Which is the best performing model now?

 

[Trip]

The general consensus here appears to be to hold off on the stuff above the 1750/1900 AC for the time being, at least until the firmwares (factory or otherwise) build enough stability and reputation (which I'd suspect would take at least until the end of the year). For the bulk of users, any supposed gains in wifi bandwidth are somewhere between hit-and-miss and non-existent, at least until the amount of quality AC endpoints and embedded solutions start to flood the market next year.

Firmware-wise, another consideration would be shibby's TomatoUSB, which in my experience has usually been more stable than DD-WRT (albeit sometimes a little less feature-rich, depending on the release variant). FWIW, I run Tomato on the WNR3500Lv2 as my go-to el-cheapo solution for a residential gigabit wired box, and I routinely see uptimes in the hundreds of days. And at 1/4 the CPU power of the stuff you're looking at, they're managing 10-20+ clients without load averages ever passing 0.25. So you should be next to zero on any properly de-bugged and correctly-installed firmware, most of the time (baring a low amount of firewall rules or other kinds of packet processing).

 

[microchip]

Is Linux exposed via ssh with Merlin's? I ask because I have some configuration in Linux and with the scheduled scripts feature of DD-WRT that I may need to keep using. For example, I have a script to workaround a DNS issue in DD-WRT and some iptables commands for firewall blocking.

If it gives me the features/flexibility, then I am all for using Merlin or whatever.

What about the router models? Which is the best performing model now?

Yes, SSH is supported in RMerlin's FW. It's not enabled by default but it's easy to enable through the GUI. Also telnet is supported too. I think both SSH and telnet are also supported by the stock ASUS FW.

 

[djtech2k]

So which router is the head of the class now? Is it the RT-AC87U?

 

[RogerSC]

At this point I'd go with either the Asus RT-AC68U or the Netgear R7000. My preference is the Netgear, but that's just me. At this point, both of these have mature firmware, and a choice of third-party firmware (dd-wrt and tomato). Both have plenty of bandwidth and performance. I believe that the Netgear has the edge relative to USB, but otherwise they both offer all the functionality that most people need.

The newer routers, like the Asus RT-AC87U and the Netgear R8000 and R7500 don't have stable firmware yet, and won't for several months. It's not fun to wait while problems get fixed, and features get added via firmware, and then those features go through the process of being made useful in the firmware. Alternative firmware takes a while to get developed and become functional as well.

That's the advice that I would give you. You need to make your own decision, just want to help you understand what you're getting into. If you're looking for a router that works well now, will have all the performance you'll need for the life of the router, then go with the solid model out of the current generation of wireless-1900AC routers. Save yourself a lot of pain, and get a running start *smile*.