SMB performance differs under QNAP QTS 4 and QTS 5 - Why and who's to blame

[Marlo]

When QTS 5 first came out, I immediately discovered a problem that was major to me, had extensive exchanges with support, and gave up and rolled back to QTS 4

Just had a go at QTS 5 again (5.1.7) now some months down the tract, again the same issue, same response from QNAP support, so again rolled back to QTS 4 (4.5.4.2790)

I maintain the issue is in the implementation of SMB in QTS 5 but can't get any interest from support, who just want to blame a third party product instead of looking at their own. My assertion is that if something works under QTS 4, it damm well should work under QTS 5.

The problem stems from the performance of a syncing program running on a windows PC, was w10 for years and everything worked, has been for months a w11 platform, also worked well till I upgraded to QTS 5

The Syncing program is GoodSync, and syncs FROM the NAS TO the windows PC, specifically to that PCs OneDrive folder. Having had so many troubles with HBS and QBAPs OneDrive api as a destination, the strategy is to collect everyones data as well as multimedia and other NAS based stores, onto a master PC and let that PCs OneDrive upload it (OneDrives Free up space on the PC means you are not really storing the data twice).

GoodSync also has very good micro level filtering so I can limit what gets presented to OneDrive saving bandwidth from large files that don't need backing up

This is all on a local network, and I have NO interest in passing my data through any other cloud servers other than the final upload under Microsofts control, so GoodSync connects to the NAS shared folders via SMB links, i.e. mapped drives, but using the network format for the links in GoodSync folder specifications, e.g. //NAS/Folder etc.

SO HERE IS THE REAL CRUNCH. Because the NAS supports access to accounting databases, the software of which keeps multiple files to make up a single accounts database, I use GoodSync to sync changed files with it's auto setting 'On File Change', so changed files only are synced and immediately uploaded by the PC to OneDrive, thus facilitating rolling back an accounts database if necessary to any time over the last 30 days (OneDrives Version retention period)

Has been working really well for years, until (twice) I upgraded QTS to V5, and GoodSync stopped getting alerts of multiple file changed on the NAS as multiple accounts were worked on, and therefore required a resource hungry scheduled full scan to find and sync changed files, thus loosing the advantages of immediate versions and recovery at any time as opposed to the scheduled sync times, let alone the resource usage.

So if anyone who is an expert at the engineering level of SMB has read this far and had a light bulb moment, would really appreciate any info that might throw a light on why a client monitoring for ALL file changes over an SMB link from Windows to QTS works under QTS 4 and not QTS 5, and then maybe I can take that to QNAP support because they have just wiped me on this, twice, once when reported under QTS 5.0.1 I think it was, and again just now under QTS 5.1.7

 

[TheLostSwede]

All I can say is, good luck. That's coming from someone that used to work for QNAP and that was fighting on behalf of customers to try and get shi-t fixed. I think you're better of asking this question in the QNAP forums though, as some people that might have an idea.

 

[Marlo]

All I can say is, good luck. That's coming from someone that used to work for QNAP and that was fighting on behalf of customers to try and get shirt fixed. I think you're better of asking this question in the QNAP forums though, as some people that might have an idea.

Thank you, I have done that also, but am familiar with some very technical savvy people on this site who might have had a more specific knowledge of SMB implementations in windows and qts.

But thanks for your insight, it's no wonder they seem to have a reputation for good hardware but not so good software.

 

[TheLostSwede]

But thanks for your insight, it's no wonder they seem to have a reputation for good hardware but not so good software.

Well, it's over a decade since I worked there, but not much seems to have changed. If anything, the few competent people they had, have left.

 

[degrub]

Just a thought, i have no specific knowledge - are both sides running the same version of SMB ?
MS has been deprecating SMB v1 with security updates.

Would RSYNC work ?

 

[RMerlin]

QTS 5.x introduced Kernel-mode SMB, which is on by default on a new 5.1 setup. Check if that's your case, and if so you can disable it to revert back to Samba. You could also try switching to it to see if you get better results.

It could also possibly be an issue tied to a Samba update rather than QTS itself. Here's the version list used by QNAP:

https://www.qnap.com/en/how-to/faq/article/what-is-the-default-samba-version-running-on-each-version-of-the-qts-operating-system

 

[Marlo]

QTS 5.x introduced Kernel-mode SMB, which is on by default on a new 5.1 setup. Check if that's your case, and if so you can disable it to revert back to Samba. You could also try switching to it to see if you get better results.

It could also possibly be an issue tied to a Samba update rather than QTS itself. Here's the version list used by QNAP:

I don't know how I missed you 5 months ago, but this is the most productive step forward I have achieved in this. However, while more modified files were detected and synced by GoodSync, not all changed files were (after I disables kernal-mode), and I can't understand why it is always the same files not synced. Whether there is some limits in later versions of samba or whatever, I will never have the smarts to know myself.

QNAP tell me QTS does NOT monitor for changed files, and GoodSync tell me they don't deploy SMB biut just call the windows standard deployment of SMB, and I get the impression neither company likes the other so impossible to get any real support from either of them.

So with this, I don't understand why QTS 4.1 behaved as required and QTS 5.0 and 5.1 do not. I have configured QTS to use MInimum and Maximum SMB 3, and I get about half changed files recognized by GoodSync.

I'm also waiting for the next build before I upgrade to QTS 5.2, where I read it has separated SMB out of QTS and it is not an app or something, whether this will change anything ????

But thanks for the best informed response I have received anywhere on this issue to date, perhaps you could take a look closer to home for me with my other big problem with ASUS router at https://www.snbforums.com/threads/2-4-ghz-wifi-connected-devices-disconnect-and.92918/

 

[Digilog]

Just a thought, i have no specific knowledge - are both sides running the same version of SMB ?
MS has been deprecating SMB v1 with security updates.

Would RSYNC work ?

samba uses Rsync to accomplish this in the background, but normally, the client is the controller of the synced folder instead of the NAS. In windows, one would use the sync package from the iSCSI program module in windows.

First, turn on the iSCSI sync module:

open the control panel and search for "sync center" in the search box in the top right hand part of the window. Click the button to turn on sync service.

Then create the network share on the client machine that points back to your NAS folder.

Find the ip address of the client machine. (ipconfig or network->status)
Then press windows key + r or start-> run and enter

//client_ip_address

and press OK. This will open the file manager with the share folder that was just made in it.
Then mouse-over the share folder and right click and select "always available offline" which will keep a copy of the NAS folder on the client machine and will sync the folder contents.
This feature has been around since windows vista.