Synology NAS as central file storage

[AvB]

My first time posting here. Stumbled across the forum trying to understand my problem problem and thought I'd join up and ask here. But firstly I wish to apologise that I probably don't even know enough to ask a sensible question.

I have a Synology 411 and a 210j. We are a very small business with 3 macs and a PC networked. The 411 is used for backups only (it replaced the 210). I want to avoid our current situation of shunting files back and forth between machines and worrying whether I have saved the latest version in the right place. So I decided to set up a central file storage unit so we can all access and save work files on one location, and a reseller gave me some basic advice on how to do it using the 210j. We need to be able to open many documents quickly and I thought that using it as a NAS and having to log on would drive me nuts so he suggested setting up the 210j as an ISCSI target (I did it with block level rather than file level; not sure if that's right). I struggled, and had to spend money buying licenses for Globalsan to get it working, and now it is working very well, but in order for it to be readily accessible to everyone quickly I have had to set it up to allow multiple connections. But there's a real risk that 2 people can inadvertently open the same file and edit it at the same time and corrupt a file (we tried, and it did).

Another thing I've realized is that if I edit a document, the other users can't see my changes till they log off and back on again - which is totally useless for me.

So it's not working for me ... can anyone tell me whether I can make this work?

And another valid question is: am I on the right track? Perhaps there's a totally different way to do this?

Thanks very much,
Andrew

 

[thiggins]

You were ill-advised to use block-level iSCSI. It really doesn't buy you anything and, as you learned, is difficult to set up for multi-user access. You would / will be fine using normal file sharing.

You need to come up with a method of checking documents in and out when editing. This could be as simple as creating a common "In Edit" folder and moving documents there before opening them. Then move them back to the proper folder when you are done.

I don't know of any Document management systems that run on NASes.

Google Docs allows multiple people to collaborate on documents simultaneously.

 

[Generic George]

My first time posting here. Stumbled across the forum trying to understand my problem problem and thought I'd join up and ask here. But firstly I wish to apologise that I probably don't even know enough to ask a sensible question.

I have a Synology 411 and a 210j. We are a very small business with 3 macs and a PC networked. The 411 is used for backups only (it replaced the 210). I want to avoid our current situation of shunting files back and forth between machines and worrying whether I have saved the latest version in the right place. So I decided to set up a central file storage unit so we can all access and save work files on one location, and a reseller gave me some basic advice on how to do it using the 210j. We need to be able to open many documents quickly and I thought that using it as a NAS and having to log on would drive me nuts so he suggested setting up the 210j as an ISCSI target (I did it with block level rather than file level; not sure if that's right). I struggled, and had to spend money buying licenses for Globalsan to get it working, and now it is working very well, but in order for it to be readily accessible to everyone quickly I have had to set it up to allow multiple connections. But there's a real risk that 2 people can inadvertently open the same file and edit it at the same time and corrupt a file (we tried, and it did).

Another thing I've realized is that if I edit a document, the other users can't see my changes till they log off and back on again - which is totally useless for me.

So it's not working for me ... can anyone tell me whether I can make this work?

And another valid question is: am I on the right track? Perhaps there's a totally different way to do this?

Thanks very much,
Andrew

Yeah, you don't want to be using iSCSI. AFAIK, it's main use is for when you want to use NAS storage as a local drive for specific machines, not as a shared repository of data. Which is probably why you are having problems with it.

As far as having to enter a password each time goes. At least with OSX you can simply tell it to connect to device X as user Y with Password Z and then not have to worry about it. I've only used NAS with windows boxes under an active directory domain structure where logging into the NAS would be redundant, but I'd be surprised if you couldn't do something similar under windows. You can use the local (nas) accounts (User Y) you create on the NAS to control things like permissions and that should help solve problems like multiple users accessing files on the NAS, since it should "lock" the file when someone has it open.

 

[AvB]

Thank you very much for the advice guys. Bummer, I've really wasted time and money going down the wrong track.

On the Synology website it says that if the right file system (OCFS or VMFS) is used you can have file protection for multi-users. I don't know anything about this, or how you would do it, but are you saying that's not a good solution? (sounds pretty complicated).

Failing that it sounds like I should write it off as a bad experience and just use it as a normal NAS - any other comments???

Andrew

 

[claykin]

What type of files? If predominantly MS Office files, consider Sharepoint (hosted). Office365 is a good solution for most SMB.

You can also look at Egnyte.

 

[AvB]

Thanks. We have to keep customers confidential files so I am not keen on hosted storage.

This is what's worrying me now - I have set it up now as a normal NAS, and it's working fine. (wish I'd just done that in the first place). I am going to set up Network Backup to backup the files on the 210j to the 411. But does this then give you just one backup version, with no ability to go back in time like Time Machine does? I can't find any info on this.

It's not uncommon for us to save over a file by mistake, and it's nice to be able to use Time Machine to retrieve the file from the backups and restore it.

 

[stevech]

SecondCopy on each PC will do a rolling archive of the last n versions of the files in a given folder or folders(s). It's just $30, mature, works reliably.

The originals can be on the PC disk or the NAS, and the users' archive can be on the NAS.

see centered.com

 

[AvB]

I found out that Synology now have a Time Backup package, so I've downloaded that and it will give archived versions. I think I'm there!

Thanks to each of you for the advice. Very much appreciated.

 

[claykin]

SecondCopy on each PC will do a rolling archive of the last n versions of the files in a given folder or folders(s). It's just $30, mature, works reliably.

The originals can be on the PC disk or the NAS, and the users' archive can be on the NAS.

see centered.com

stevech

Have you compared Second Copy to Syncback Pro? I recall comparing them a couple years back and preferring Syncback for its flexibility and speed. And if I recall correctly Secondcopy was not supporting copying in use files on x64 systems. I assume thats been added?

 

[minghi]

Is clearcase what you are looking for?

I'm a programmer and at work multiple people have access to the same folder and the same files. Now, say if I want to edit a file, I would "checkout" the file which is as simple as right click and select checkout, then i would make the changes and then check back in, so another user can make changes similarly. The best thing about it is version control, say I add some bad code and check in, someone else can just right click, see the code in my previous checkout and select that as the latest so all is well, also you can see who wrote what code etc.

If this is not what you are looking for, sorry if i wasted your time

 

[claykin]

I'm a programmer and at work multiple people have access to the same folder and the same files. Now, say if I want to edit a file, I would "checkout" the file which is as simple as right click and select checkout, then i would make the changes and then check back in, so another user can make changes similarly. The best thing about it is version control, say I add some bad code and check in, someone else can just right click, see the code in my previous checkout and select that as the latest so all is well, also you can see who wrote what code etc.

If this is not what you are looking for, sorry if i wasted your time

Great. What solution do you use to accomplish check in/out of files?

 

[stevech]

stevech

Have you compared Second Copy to Syncback Pro? I recall comparing them a couple years back and preferring Syncback for its flexibility and speed. And if I recall correctly Secondcopy was not supporting copying in use files on x64 systems. I assume thats been added?

Yes, I tried that and all others that were free or inexpensive. For me, Second Copy is the preferred by a good margin, and it's been running here on several computers for a long time. Support is responsive too. I don't use Win 64 by choice so I can't comment on that.

 

[sfx2000]

I think the OP really has multiple problems - iSCSI is only one...

If there are multiple documents, and they are actively being edited/revised, then what is really needed is a DMS - Document Management System.

That, and a production workflow process that is documented and agreed to.