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WD Caviar Black vs Green. 7200 vs 5400 rpm

mfc

Occasional Visitor
If I copied an 80 GB file from a computer with a WD Velociraptor drive to a QNAP TS-639 filled with the latest WD Caviar Green 1TB drives over gigabit ethernet, would the bottleneck be the network speed or the hard drive? I am wondering if the speed benefits of WD Caviar Black drives would be noticeable, or if the network speed would be a bottleneck such that spending the extra money for the extra drive speed would be a waste? I will be using the NAS primarily for computer backups.

I read the latest Green drives are faster than the first generation and can reach 111 MB/s. The max networks speeds for NAS users seem to be around 75 MB/s with the network overhead and the onboard ethernet being the bottleneck.
 
If I copied an 80 GB file from a computer with a WD Velociraptor drive to a QNAP TS-639 filled with the latest WD Caviar Green 1TB drives over gigabit ethernet, would the bottleneck be the network speed or the hard drive? I am wondering if the speed benefits of WD Caviar Black drives would be noticeable, or if the network speed would be a bottleneck such that spending the extra money for the extra drive speed would be a waste? I will be using the NAS primarily for computer backups.

I read the latest Green drives are faster than the first generation and can reach 111 MB/s. The max networks speeds for NAS users seem to be around 75 MB/s with the network overhead and the onboard ethernet being the bottleneck.

Gigabit network is 125 MB/sec. From my testing I have found that actual speeds max out more around 117 MB/sec. Please refer to this link for more info about the WD drives... http://www.tomshardware.com/charts/.../compare,658.html?prod[2057]=on&prod[2239]=on take a look at the min/max and average for read/write. From what I can tell the WD Cavair Black drive would be 10 MB/sec faster across the board.

If you are using just a single drive then the hard drive would most likely be the bottleneck. If you are using a RAID 0 or 10 array then most likely the network would be the bottleneck. At least in my opinion.

00Roush
 
Thanks. I bought a green drive to test. I compared a 1 TB WD Green with an old 150 WD Raptor (since a VelociRaptor doesn't fit into a NAS), and the Green was noticably faster than the 10,000 RPM Raptor. It was around 5 MB/s faster when writing a 2.5 GB file and around 7-10 MB/s faster when writing a 1 GB file. This suggests that the speed of the hard drive is a bottleneck. I ordered a WD black drive today so I could compare it to the green.

My test was with only 1 drive in the NAS, so no RAID was involved.
 
I bought a WD Black drive, which is supposedly one of the fastest 7200 RPM drives around, and performed a series of tests against a 1 TB WD10EADS Green drive in my QNAP TS-639 NAS. Both drives have Feb 2009 manufacture dates. To my surprise the green drive was consistently faster at writes than the black drive. All of my write tests showed the green drive being faster. When testing from my old slow server, the writes to the green drive were 1-2 MB/s faster, and when testing from my newest server the writes were 5-6MB/s faster to the green drive. The tests were highly reproducible, so I am comfortable with the unexpected conclusion.

My test network was just a standard unmanaged 1 gigabit non-jumbo frame network. I might get different results with a faster network configuration.

For my read tests, the speeds were equivalent, although reads are dramatically faster and most likely I am seeing a lot of cache speed as opposed to hard drive speed. So for the read tests there is a good chance I am limited by my network setup.

There is confusion about the spin speed of the latest green drives. Most stores seem to list the speed as 7200 RPM. Some sites say it is 5400-7200 RPM. Some people say that the drives run at 5400 RPM and every site that has them at 7200 RPM is wrong. Some sites say that the old 1 TB drives are 5400 RPM, the new 1 TB drives are 7200 RPM, and the new 2 TB drives are 5400 RPM. The official WD spec page has them listed as variable speed drives.
 
I performed more performance tests focused on the network. I tried link aggregation with a HP ProCurve 1800 switch, plus combinations of jumbo packets and standard packets. Nothing of the network optimizations I performed impacted the speed.

I find the speed of the QNAP TS-639 disappointing. It is essentially the same speed as a five year old server that I was hoping to replace. A server I built last year is dramatically faster than the QNAP (although it does have VelociRaptor drives). The QNAP is one of the slowest devices on my network, even though it has a very fast WD Caviar Black drive in it. I don't think my network, my other servers, or the installed hard drives can be blamed for the slow speeds, since I am getting much faster speeds from other devices on the same network and I am getting roughly equivalent speeds from an old server that has old slow drives in it.

I notice that the QNAP TS-639 doesn't get listed on speed charts, including the smallnetbuilder chart. In fact, I don't recall ever seeing a comparative speed listing, even though comparative speed listings for the TS-509 are common. Perhaps the company knows that the device is much slower than comparable devices and isn't sending sample units to reviewers.

The fastest read time I have been able to get out of it is 61 MB/s and the fastest write time I have achieved is 45 MB/s.

A HP MediaCenter EX485 NAS I have is noticeably faster using the default drive and default configurations. The MediaCenter was half the price of the QNAP.

I have not tried iSCSI yet, so maybe that is the trick to getting it to be faster.
 
I'm not sure I'm so surprised with the results you are getting. I apologise if you know this stuff, but for info:

A single, sequential, giant file copy is the absolutely kindest thing you can do to a disk drive to get good performance. It's the equivalent of trying to find the top speed of a car but testing on a perfectly straight road, going down a steep hill and with a strong wind behind you.

If you think about it, ignoring any bottlenecks in the electronics, the speed you'll get for a sequential read depends on 2 basic factors:

1: How fast the disk platter is rotating under the read head and
2: How tightly packed together are the bits - i.e. bit density

The main reason speeds have been climbing over the last decade are bit density. If I can pack twice as many bits in a linear inch even if my rotation speed doesn't change I'll double my sequential performance.

I don't know your Green/Black model numbers, but have you checked to see if they are the same platter bit density? If the Greens are 333GB platters but the Blacks are 250GB then the bit density advantage to Green could offset the rotational speed benefit of Black - for large sequential reads or writes.

I can't speak for NAS environments in general or for your own needs at all, but in large scale enterprise systems where I have experience you tend to have dozens of jobs/databases/mail systems and hundreds of users all beating on the storage at the same time.

Ignoring any queues that build up, once it is the turn of your IO operation the effective speed of response of the disk is governed by 2 key points:

1: How long it takes to position the disk head over the part of the platter where your data lives and
2: How fast it reads once it gets there (the peak sequential speed we mentioned above)

Item 1, the positioning time has two components also. How long it takes to move the disk arm back and forth to position the right distance from the centre of the spindle, and how long it takes for the first bit of your data to rotate round the spindle to get under the disk head.

A 5400rpm disk rotates once every 1/5400 of a minute or every 11.1 milliseconds. On average it takes 1/2 a rotation to get your data in position (sometimes it's just gone past when you start looking, sometimes you get lucky, on average it is half a rotation). A 7200rpm disk rotates once every 8.3ms. If your sequential read speed is 100 MBytes/second you can read (or write) 100 Kbytes in a millisecond. [This gives the interesting observation that if your drive can do 100 MBytes per second = 100 KB per ms, and (for a Green) we know that it takes 11.1ms per rotation, then the disk must have about 100KB * 11.1 = 1.1MB around a full track rotation.]

Anyway, for non-video processing, normal enterprise workloads reading customer records and bank statements, or even wordprocessing etc average IO requests are probably in the few KB to few 10's of KB, i.e. well under 1ms to read at 100KB per ms, so overall response is goverened by the positioning speed and sequential transfer speed is almost irrelevant, hence IO performance goes in line with latency = rotational speed, hence 7200,10k, 15krpm drives.

For giant, sequential, one IO does gigabytes of transfer then positioning time is zero to all intents and purposes and the only thing that matters is the values you are measuring, but you are seeing minimal benefit of 7200rpm possibly because of bit density discussed above.

Finally, watch out that a peak speed of 100-110MB/sec tends to be on the outer tracks of the disk, down at the centre you'll probably see half of that so an average over the whole disk may be around 75-80 and that is well within the cababilities of a good gigabit ethernet controller.

Hope I didn't bore everyone to death and that was of some interest to someone somewhere.

Kind regards

Crash
 
Thanks, Crash. It's always good to review the issues behind drive performance.
 
I performed more performance tests focused on the network. I tried link aggregation with a HP ProCurve 1800 switch, plus combinations of jumbo packets and standard packets. Nothing of the network optimizations I performed impacted the speed.

I find the speed of the QNAP TS-639 disappointing. It is essentially the same speed as a five year old server that I was hoping to replace. A server I built last year is dramatically faster than the QNAP (although it does have VelociRaptor drives). The QNAP is one of the slowest devices on my network, even though it has a very fast WD Caviar Black drive in it. I don't think my network, my other servers, or the installed hard drives can be blamed for the slow speeds, since I am getting much faster speeds from other devices on the same network and I am getting roughly equivalent speeds from an old server that has old slow drives in it.

I notice that the QNAP TS-639 doesn't get listed on speed charts, including the smallnetbuilder chart. In fact, I don't recall ever seeing a comparative speed listing, even though comparative speed listings for the TS-509 are common. Perhaps the company knows that the device is much slower than comparable devices and isn't sending sample units to reviewers.

The fastest read time I have been able to get out of it is 61 MB/s and the fastest write time I have achieved is 45 MB/s.

A HP MediaCenter EX485 NAS I have is noticeably faster using the default drive and default configurations. The MediaCenter was half the price of the QNAP.

I have not tried iSCSI yet, so maybe that is the trick to getting it to be faster.

What OS are you using on the client and what are you using to test with?

iSCSI might be able to help but it really depends on the client OS. FTP would be a good way to test if you really want to see what the max the NAS is capable of as it has the lowest overhead.

00Roush
 
The 639 is slower than the 509 ... and the 509 has two SODIMM ports so you can use 4GB RAM, with 3.5GB being addressable. In that price range, the TS509 with 4GB of RAM is pretty hard to beat.

The READYNAS PRO we're testing is more expensive...but much faster. I've got 4GB of RAM coming for it so we can test back to back vs the TS509 which we use with 4GB of RAM.

Cheers,
Dennis.
 
To clarify the tests I ran, I am doing simplistic copying of files using the Windows Explorer. The servers I used in my tests were both running Windows 2003 Server. I created two files using fsutil, a 1 GB file and a 2.5 GB file (ex: fsutil file createnew c:\1gbfile.txt 1073741824). I will do more tests later with iSCSI and FTP.

My goal was to see if the green drives were suitable for use in this NAS, which will primarily be used for backup of drives images and virtual machines. Money isn't really an issue since the black drives are only around $10-$20 more than the green drives these days. I have read many people commenting that the green drives are noticeably slow, but I think they are commenting on the prior versions of these drives or commenting on the idea of using these inside of a workstation computer as a system drive. My tests show that the black and green drives are the same speed when used in my NAS and that there is a bottleneck that constrains the speeds to be far lower than what the drives are capable of.

As an FYI, I spoke with someone at HP who told me to say away for green drives in MediaSmart servers. I think Netgear also removed official support for green drives due to the problems that arise when the drives spin down, although QNAP officially supports them.
 
I did some quick tests of FTP and iSCSI.

On my old server, copying files over FTP to the QNAP NAS was significantly faster than Windows Explorer, by over 10 MB/s. It still doesn't reach the speed of my faster server.

On my newer faster server, copying files over FTP didn't result in much of a speed gain. Maybe 1-2 MB/s, if I'm being generous.

Using iSCSI the speeds were noticeably slower. I didn't spend much time testing it because it was painful to see such a disappointing result and setting this up on multiple computers takes some time and hassle. I tested from one of my XP machines and I got 30 MB/s using Windows Explorer over a UNC connection, 41 MB/s using FTP, and 13 MB/s using iSCSI. So iSCSI was less than half the speed of Windows Explorer copying to a UNC share. I don't think there is any reason I would use iSCSI considering that severe speed penalty.

iSCSI is generally supposed to be a faster way of connecting to network hard drives, but QNAP seems to have a very low-end implementation that is absent any speed benefits.

In summary, I think the QNAP TS 639 has a hardware bottleneck that will prevent any of the leading hard drives from reaching its full potential. Purchasing the cheaper green drives is the better choice than purchasing the black drives for this NAS.
 
I used the latest Microsoft iSCSI initiator for WinXP 32 bit, since that is what the QNAP iSCSI instructions use.
 
I used the latest Microsoft iSCSI initiator for WinXP 32 bit, since that is what the QNAP iSCSI instructions use.
As you found, its performance is not that good.
Does anyone have other suggestions for a better-performing iSCSI initiator for Windows?
 
I am not sure that the Windows iSCSI initiator is the problem. I previously did some iSCSI testing using Ubuntu and Vista SP1. From what I recall file copy speeds were similar to file copies using SMB. Using Win XP though I found speeds were a bit lower than SMB file copies. I posted some of my results in this thread... http://forums.smallnetbuilder.com/showthread.php?t=499. Since then I have done a lot more testing with file copies on Vista and XP. I have come to the conclusion that the XP file copy engine is the reason XP is slower for SMB file copies than Vista. I also believe the XP copy engine could be the reason iSCSI is slower than SMB for file copies on XP. I can explain more in detail if you would like but it basically comes down to the Vista copy engine is multithreaded and XP is not.

On a side note I have found that the standard windows ftp implementation does not seem to give the best performance. I prefer using filezilla as the client because it has much better performance. Just something to try.

00Roush
 
For speed testing I used FileZilla as my FTP client and whatever comes with the QNAP OS as the FTP server.

For my iSCSI testing I used a 1 GB file, which likely doesn't represent the speed of a small file.

I didn't spend much time doing repeatable iSCSI tests since my goal was to see if I could get over the approx. 45 MB/s large file write speed bottleneck and the early tests suggested that iSCSI didn't have much potential to achieve that goal.
 
Ignoring iSCSI for a bit, since I disabled that, I did a Black vs Green speed test using the ATTO disk benchmark tool, which unfortunately only tests small files (up to 8MB). If anyone is interested, below are the charts. These tests use link aggregation and non-jumbo packet sizes. Eyeballing the charts it appears that the black drive has write speeds 20 MB/s faster than the green drive write speeds. The read speeds are roughly equivalent. I'm not sure if this speed difference can be applied to very large files and my testing suggested that there was no meaningful speed difference with very large files.

I also put up a test of a local VelociRaptor drive and an HP MediaSmart server for comparison purposes.

1 TB WD Green in QNAP NAS
Single Green Drive in QNAP.gif

1 TB WD Black in QNAP NAS
Single Black Drive in QNAP.gif

Local VelociRaptor 300 GB
Velociraptor Local.gif

HP MediaSmart EX485
HP MediaSmart EX485.gif
 

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