Wi-Fi setup for small motel

[Jim_Lafleur]

Hi,

My client wants a strong wi-fi for his small motel. He'd like his customers to take advantage of the full speed of his internet connection (60Mbps Download and 10Mbps Upload.).

Right now there's only one Engenius ECB3500 and customers on the far end only get like 0.50Mbps/0.25Mbps.

I'd like to install a strong wi-fi system. I'm a computer tech with excellent networking skills and with experience intalling wi-fi in homes, but when it comes to figure out what equipment to install for Wi-Fi in hotels/motels, I'm a little hesitant (by lack of experience).

I would like some ideas from you guys in what would be the best possibilities, please. I don't think it's possible to run wires inside the Motel. Maybe 1 or 2 cables outside the main building, under the eaves, would be feasible. Would powerline adapters be a stable option? Would installing a repeater (or wired WAP) on the utility pole be a good idea ? Wireless mesh style Access points perhaps? (Example: Ubiquity Unifi (It's just an example. I'm open to any brand)). Any ideas would be greatly appreciated.

Here are satellite pictures of the model with measurements, below.

 

[netwrks]

You can post here: http://community.ubnt.com/ ~ they can answer your questions.

 

[Jim_Lafleur]

You can post here: http://community.ubnt.com/ ~ they can answer your questions.

Good idea. I've mentioned Ubiquity but, just so you know, I'm open to any brand of equipment.

 

[thiggins]

Multiple APs, connected via Ethernet is the best way. Placing APs outside is ok, but you need to use weather-rated APs and make sure they are secured from tampering.

You'll need business grade APs that can be managed and configured centrally. Ubiquity is one option. There are also small managed APs solutions available from EnGenius, ZyXEL and others. Most folks here will probably steer you to Ubiquiti.

 

[System Error Message]

multiple APs connected via ethernet. Theres really no point using APs outside because you want wifi connection focused on the inside. Place a few APs in the buildings, wire them up even though it may be a lot of effort. Placing very strong APs on a utility pole in the middle is going to give poor results because the client can see the AP but wont be strong enough to talk back as clients will see a strong signal but get poor speeds or cant connect.

Identify the central locations in the building where an AP would best go. At that internet bandwidth you dont need to worry about flooding an AP with traffic. You will however need to apply client isolation and have a good router to manage multiple users and QoS and also provide the login page/billing page.

Indoor APs are also much cheaper than outdoors so multiple indoor APs + ethernet wiring would be cheaper and have better signal. Is wifi necessary on the outside? That utility pole can end up attracting lightning.

 

[Jim_Lafleur]

They don't need a billing system so that simplifies things. Installing APs inside would be an idea. It's just that all the building made of rooms, rooms, rooms and more rooms (except at the extremities). So all the walls of the rooms would add up to stop the signal, right? It would be nice to have an AP like at the middle of the main building, but there's no separate space there (like a lounge or nothing). There's the office on the extreme right. There's a laundry (used by the staff) on the extreme left. Plus there's no hallway (It's a Motel, you know). Wouldn't it be better to install like 3 or 4 outdoors APs under the eaves, for example?

 

[System Error Message]

the entrances to the rooms, is there a porch or some roof infront that would suit placing an AP on it?

From the looks of it 3 APs will cover all the rooms, than 1 outdoor AP that you already have for general use in other area.

Walls is one thing but distance is another. The closer the AP is even 5 walls wont stop a 5Ghz signal.

 

[pege63]

I would do it like this 3-4 AP should do it (RED=AP) (Ubiquiti Unifi AP AC LR/AC PRO)

 

[Jim_Lafleur]

OK,

Here's more detailed photos:

 

[Jim_Lafleur]

the entrances to the rooms, is there a porch or some roof infront that would suit placing an AP on it?

Yes there's an eave (look at new pictures posted above)

 

[Jim_Lafleur]

I would do it like this 3-4 AP should do it (RED=AP) (Ubiquiti Unifi AP AC LR/AC PRO)

That looks good. Does the AP AC PRO have the same range as the AP AC LR (Beside the increased 5Ghz speed)?

 

[pege63]

That looks good. Does the AP AC PRO have the same range as the AP AC LR (Beside the increased 5Ghz speed)?

Ubiquiti Unifi AP AC LR Indoor unit, Range: 183 meters (600 feet)
Ubiquiti Unifi AP AC PRO Indoor/Outdoor unit, Range: 122 meters (400 feet)
Read also:
Ubiquiti UniFi made me realize how terrible consumer Wi-Fi gear is

 

[System Error Message]

engenius dont make consumer wifi. Indoor wifi is cheaper than outdoor wifi units however not all consumer wifi gear is terrible. The only difference is that people are less likely to steal your unifi/engenius AP than they are to steal an ASUS router.

Consumer wifi routers from a decent brand do work well as APs. I've been using ASUS routers as APs and an enterprise capable router as my main router instead.

Place the units on the ceiling outside the rooms around the middle areas. Just remember that ethernet max range is 100 meters and at those distances i would avoid using POE from a POE switch all the way from the router.

 

[sfx2000]

I'd like to install a strong wi-fi system. I'm a computer tech with excellent networking skills and with experience intalling wi-fi in homes, but when it comes to figure out what equipment to install for Wi-Fi in hotels/motels, I'm a little hesitant (by lack of experience).

I would like some ideas from you guys in what would be the best possibilities, please. I don't think it's possible to run wires inside the Motel. Maybe 1 or 2 cables outside the main building, under the eaves, would be feasible. Would powerline adapters be a stable option? Would installing a repeater (or wired WAP) on the utility pole be a good idea ? Wireless mesh style Access points perhaps? (Example: Ubiquity Unifi (It's just an example. I'm open to any brand)). Any ideas would be greatly appreciated.

To be honest - you're probably out of your skill set - and that's ok - you're not the first one to ask this question.

With a hospitality network, it's more than just providing coverage - it's about privacy for the guests, liability for the hotel, and these are business issues, not technical issues.

Here's a use case - guest checks into the hotel and starts to do "bad things" - surf childporn, pirate SW, hack, etc... who is liable - and who has protection - if you're the network integrator, and you've not defined limits of liability, it could be you in court instead of the guest or the owner of the hotel.

My recommendation - walk away from this project...

 

[Mokers]

To be honest - you're probably out of your skill set - and that's ok - you're not the first one to ask this question.

With a hospitality network, it's more than just providing coverage - it's about privacy for the guests, liability for the hotel, and these are business issues, not technical issues.

Here's a use case - guest checks into the hotel and starts to do "bad things" - surf childporn, pirate SW, hack, etc... who is liable - and who has protection - if you're the network integrator, and you've not defined limits of liability, it could be you in court instead of the guest or the owner of the hotel.

My recommendation - walk away from this project...

I would add to sfx2000. There are ways to do this. the OP is asking a great question about the technical challenges in terms of signal, but there are a lot of other challenges you may have relating to the business. I would recommend something like a Meraki MR42. It is going to be pricy (about $1000 per AP including the license), but with that license comes a very easy way to setup guest access and captive portals without having to know too much about networking. It will also keep wifi clients from seeing each other without having to worry about setting up VLANs, etc.

 

[Jim_Lafleur]

With a hospitality network, it's more than just providing coverage - it's about privacy for the guests, liability for the hotel, and these are business issues, not technical issues... ... if you're the network integrator, and you've not defined limits of liability, it could be you in court instead of the guest or the owner of the hotel.

Thanks for the information. I'll keep this in mind. I'll do more search about it.

Do you mean that we need to know which guest did what on the internet? Is that what we need in term of liability protection? I guess we could also isolate each guests from each other.

 

[Jim_Lafleur]

OK. So far, from what I understand :

1. It's better to use many APs not too far from each other. Since if a device is too far from an AP, it might be able to download good but won't be able to upload properly.
2. It's better to use Cat5e cable instead of using repeaters.

If we install AC APs close to one each other, do we have to change something with the Channel BandWidth to prevent too much signal interference (Since AC uses large bandwidth)?

For a motel, if we put the APs inside, with many rooms' walls (wood frame with drywall) to cross by the signal: Would 200' appart be a good rule of thumb?

 

[Jim_Lafleur]

Do some of you guys have some experience with Powerline adapters for using the powerline instead of running cables? Could they be a viable solution (Stable enough)?

I mean we could use a couple of those adapters and plug APs in it. It would be simple to deploy, without running cables. Maybe not as a permanent solution. They would allow to test many AP locations. And if we need to reboot them too often, then we could run a wire to that location.

 

[System Error Message]

powerline adapters depends on the quality of cabling and distance. To get decent speeds you're looking at AV1200 or AV2000 as long as they have multi user and multi frequency. Running ethernet is cheaper than using powerline but you do have the issue of keeping the cables weather proof and out of the way.

 

[Jim_Lafleur]

I needed to apply a quickfix before I went on vacation, since they needed WiFi really bad. So I figured I'd give powerline a try. The AV500 are kinda affordable. I went and purchased many TP-Link TL-WPA4220 (AV500). Installed one every 3 rooms. I couldn't go further than 180 feet from the router. At 210 ft the powerline signal was too weak. It was just enough for us. I could get 10Mbps download and 3 Mbps upload with a 59ms ping (and sometimes better). The 4 wi-fi TL-WPA4220 were solid. I had a TL-PA4010 AV500 (no wifi), which stopped working after a few days (it was used as the connection to the router). I'll have to try resetting it and give it another chance. I had a TL-PA9020P KIT (AV2000) I wanted to test out. One of them was dead on arrival (DOA). It worked for 5 minutes then stopped working. And the best link I could get was 600 Mbps (even when 12 feet appart). I wanted to use it to be able to cover the second building (West part). I've used the one that was working as the main connection to the router (Yes AV2000 is compatible with AV500).

When I was done, yesterday, I said to the owner : "Your main building is covered. You should be alright for this week." He replied : "No, No, I need the other building covered too. The motel is full until the end of the summer". So I've tried to figure something out quick and went to buy an Asus RT-AC3100 locally. I've installed it in another building (In the window) where he happened to have internet also. Guess what, that single Access Point could reach all the rooms everywhere! I could get speeds like 27Mbps download / 10Mbps upload / 60ms ping almost everywhere. From the Motel office (235ft from the access point) the speed was still super good (12Mbps / 4Mbps / 58ms). And at the pool too (34Mbps / 10Mbps / 58ms). See coverage below. So we won't need the powerline at all! I think I'll keep using powerline in the future, but for testing wi-fi signal only, before we run the real cables.

It's possible we leave it as is. But I've got new infos yesterday: They have a heated basement under the rooms! Here's our "hall"! We could just run cables and place 1 or 2 RT-AC3100 in the basement and it'd give great wi-fi to the rooms.