WiFi Router Channel Bandwidth ?

[ascanio1]

Thanks for helping out! Appreciated.

I have been advised over and over to add an AP instead of more power and more gain but I have had answer, over and over, that I cannot go that way:
1) Wife won't alllow cables/restructuring
2) Powerline offers mixed results (sometimes excellent, sometimes terrible) depending on who's using which appliance and when - old building with unmasked, old wiring.

So I am posting here because I need a solution whcih does not involve cables and/or my home's electrical network.

A couple of things here, "higher gain" antennas will also be more directional.

I thought that there were omni directional antennas although the one I bought gave me zero extra gain (I can't post links, please copy/paste):
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I don't care if the dughnut is flat as a pizza because I have all mt clients on the same plane.

Higher transmit power will not help the router hear the client better, and the router and client need to be able to hear each other for network protocols to work, not just the client hear the router better.

So, if the router can shout "Here is the first packet" and never hears ""I got it, thanks, now send the next one!" it will never send the next one. right?

Thanks! Now I finally understand the concept! Until now I did not understand it. Ok, got it. I'm a bit dumb wit IT as I keep applying non IT logic: if I tell my soldier an order I expect him to execute. The Router-Client handshake is not similar to an Officer-Soldier salute. It has to be 2-ways.

I originally increased the power from 70mAH to 200mAH. Then following a member's advice I reduced it to 125mAH but now I will turn it down all the way to the original stock setting of 70mAH.

So I hope that this is clear.

Yes, it is, but it still does not solve my problem: I still cannot watch movies.

 

[stevech]

A couple of things here, "higher gain" antennas will also be more directional.

Clarification.. there are relatively high gain antenna that are omni-directional on the horizontal plane but directional on the vertical plane. A pattern like a doughnut. Higher the gain, flatter the doughnut. So a 12dBi gain omni (on H) has a 8 degree or so pattern on V. If that antenna were on the roof of a 4 story building, and you were on the ground within, say, 100 ft., you'd get a weak signal. Move out to 500 ft., it would be better. Visualize the angles.

The antenna pattern plots are given for pro quality antennas, such as (page 3 of)...
http://www.l-com.com/multimedia/datasheets/DS_HG2412U-PRO.PDF

a 12dBi omni is physically large and wouldn't be used indoors.
But 6-9dBi is reasonably sized.

Of course, the latest MIMO WiFi has internal phased array antennas and the effective "gain" is more about the statistics of benefit of various MIMO methods.

 

[ascanio1]

a 12dBi omni is physically large and wouldn't be used indoors.

I'm at a dead end here... I'll have to try a 12dBi omni even if it is huge (my router is in a cabinet, invisible).
Would you help me to select the best 12 dBi MIMO antennas in 2.4 and 5 for my Asus AC66U, please?
I can't find any online. They are all either 2.4GHz or 5GHz, but not both together and not MIMO.

I wish that someone on this forum could point me in the right direction: I don't mind spending a few hundred bucks for professional grade +12 dBi omni Mimo 2.4/5GHz antennas! It will still be cheaper than doing reconstruction work (if my wife even allowed me to) in my home for new cables!

I spent 15$ for a set of 3x +9 dBi, online, and it did not solve anything. I just wasted time and money. Now I'm now waiting for a second set of 3x +9dBi antennas, but I'm sure that also these cheap things won't offer any gain at all, just as the previous set.

 

[stevech]

I've lost the bubble on what your problem is... in terms of weak signals (from/to where with what)...

But going from standard 2 or 5 dBi antennas to 9dBi is just 3-4 dB more.
The path loss from transmitter to receiver indoors, with some drywall in the path (no thick wood furniture, or floors).. the path loss attenuation is about 70dB or more. So improving by 3-4 dB is a nit. A little math: WiFi router is, say, about 20dBm radiated power (including antenna gain); path loss is 70dB (assume); receiver antenna gain (client) is near 0, or negative; so we have +20-70 = -50dBm received. But no take -70 10 or 20 dB more due to walls/floors, sub-optimal placements, and you get into the -70s received. That's good but not great.

If you really need 10+ dB more signal strength, here are your options:

• Relocate the WiFi router to reduce distance or walls/blockages
• Get a better client device, or if it's a desktop, reposition its antennas or use a USB WiFi adapter w/extension cable
• Add an Access Point (AP) to create new coverage in the weak area. This is the usual method. There's a how-to/FAQ on this website on this topic. Example: ASUS RT-N12 is low cost and has an AP mode. Simple. Also, any spare WiFi router can be reconfigured to be an AP.

 

[sfx2000]

I agree with Steve... We've done about as much as we can with recommendations and advice.

Wish you the best of luck!

sfx

 

[stevech]

We could petition the Allmighty to change the laws of physics in Radio Frequency wave propagation.

 

[ascanio1]

I've lost the bubble on what your problem is... in terms of weak signals (from/to where with what)...

I can't stream FullHD movies.
I can't lay cables.
Powerline (tried) won't work because of interference.

But going from standard 2 or 5 dBi antennas to 9dBi is just 3-4 dB more.

Basically less than a 5% upgrade.

The path loss from transmitter to receiver indoors, with some drywall in the path (no thick wood furniture, or floors).. the path loss attenuation is about 70dB or more. So improving by 3-4 dB is a nit. A little math: WiFi router is, say, about 20dBm radiated power (including antenna gain); path loss is 70dB (assume); receiver antenna gain (client) is near 0, or negative; so we have +20-70 = -50dBm received. But no take -70 10 or 20 dB more due to walls/floors, sub-optimal placements, and you get into the -70s received. That's good but not great.

In short, there is nothing I can do.

If you really need 10+ dB more signal strength, here are your options:

• Relocate the WiFi router to reduce distance or walls/blockages
• Get a better client device, or if it's a desktop, reposition its antennas or use a USB WiFi adapter w/extension cable
• Add an Access Point (AP) to create new coverage in the weak area. This is the usual method. There's a how-to/FAQ on this website on this topic. Example: ASUS RT-N12 is low cost and has an AP mode. Simple. Also, any spare WiFi router can be reconfigured to be an AP.

None of the above are possible so this closes the thread!
I sincerely appreciate your help, even if there is nothing that I can do except petition a Guy up there...

Do you know on which Forum he hangs out?

 

[ascanio1]

Can you check this thread and help me there, please?
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/forum
s.smallnetbu
ilder.com/showthr
ead.php?t=14520

 

[stevech]

If you can/will work at it, and with some advise here, powerline IP can work.

And, have you considered using MoCA?

 

[RogerSC]

Can you check this thread and help me there, please?
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/forum
s.smallnetbu
ilder.com/showthr
ead.php?t=14520

So is this a second router that you want to use as an Access Point? This is fairly simple to do:

1. Connect one of the LAN ports on your main router to a LAN port on your AP (AP WAN port is not used, unless the router specifically allows this). Don't bother to configure the WAN port on the AP, it is not used.

2. Turn off DHCP and UPNP on the AP.

3. Set the AP router's IP to an unused address (outside of the main router's DHCP pool is a good idea) in the same subnet as the main router; e.g. if the main router is at 192.168.1.1, then you could put the AP at 192.168.1.2.

It can be this simple. There's an article on this website to help you:

http://www.smallnetbuilder.com/wireless/wireless-basics/30338-how-to-convert-a-wireless-router-into-an-access-point

If this isn't what you're trying to do, please tell me what it is you're trying to do. A collection of screen shots is hard to comment on without understanding how you're trying to set up the additional router (as an AP?).

 

[RogerSC]

Can you check this thread and help me there, please?
ht
tp:/
/forum
s.smallnetbu
ilder.com/showthr
ead.php?t=14520

You know, there's two easy things to do to get URL's into your postings that actually are useful:

1. The image of the world with the link of a chain underneath it in the editing symbols above your posting when you're editing it can be used to insert a usable, live URL in your postings.

2. If you use the "Preview Post" function (next to the "Submit Reply" button), you can actually see what your posting is like before it is posted. And you can test your URL's to be sure that they work. People aren't likely to follow a URL if they have to collect it up with cut-and-paste off of 4 lines of text to re-assemble it into their browser's location bar.

 

[sfx2000]

I can't stream FullHD movies.
I can't lay cables.
Powerline (tried) won't work because of interference.


Basically less than a 5% upgrade.



In short, there is nothing I can do.



None of the above are possible so this closes the thread!
I sincerely appreciate your help, even if there is nothing that I can do except petition a Guy up there...

Do you know on which Forum he hangs out?

WiFi is pretty useful, but it does have limitations, and perhaps your situation is one of those.

Don't despair - the limitations are what they are, but the folks that work on HomePlug, MoCA, 802.11 - they're always working to bend the laws of physics... I'm not saying to throw hardware at the problem, but keep an eye on this site - every year things get better...

 

[ascanio1]

Stevech,
I really do appreciate your help.

If you can/will work at it, and with some advise here, powerline IP can work.

Ok, let's try. I had 4 netgear powerline adapters which I gave away. I'll buy others on eBay. Please, can you reccommend me (not refer me to the chart) a couple of the best options?

By the way, I'm buying a new laptop (Vaio) and phone (Note 3) running on 802.11a/c

And, have you considered using MoCA?

Does MoCA require laying cables? I cannot work on the walls and ceiling, unless you're a pretty darn good divorce lawyer willing to work for free for me! The antenna goes from the roof to the TV coming in from the balcony.

 

[stevech]

Idea with MoCA is to use existing TV coax, and with splitters of the right sort/config, the coax carries both TV and MoCA signals.

You could of course put in new coax for MoCA.

All depends on what coax exists, what you want to do.

 

[ascanio1]

Won't work for me,then.
My antenna comes from the roof straight to the balcony and tv.

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