DIR-655: Wireless setup question

[thiggins]

Thanks for the replies.

I'm having a hard time believing that the router change caused the problem, unless there is some setting in the router that is blocking browsing traffic. But that would only occur if traffic were going across the router, LAN to WAN or WAN to LAN. All of this is happening on the LAN side of the router, which is just a switch.

I guess you should switch back to the old router and see if things change. Make sure you record all of the IP information in each computer first. Then see if it is different when the adapters get their DHCP info from the old router.

 

[jdabbs]

If you are running a 3rd party software firewall, the new subnet may not be in "trusted" status.

Windows is also not conducive to NETBIOS troubleshooting. It may be more time-efficient to disable NETBIOS, then let it rebuild itself by individually re-adding systems.

 

[Mediaman]

Update .....

I still cannot see any of my workgroup PCs, from ANY of my machines. After untold hours at this, I am really at my wits end. HELP !

To recap,

• seven machines – one VISTA HOME; six Win XP SP3
• new router – DIR 655 and a Trendnet as access point
• DCHP reserved manuuly assinged IP static addresses on all machines
• admin pages confirm above
• NetBIOS over TCP/IP enabled on all machines (see ref below)
• Master Browser is anable on VISTA and disabled on all other machines
• Link-Layer Topology Discovery Mapper and network discovery are enabled
• All machines on the same workgroup ( in fact I changed the workgroup name to a new one just in case that was the problem – it was not).
• WAN – good both for wired and wireless access to the internet
• Full access to the router admin pages from any machines

Problem is LAN - I cannot see any of my workgroup PCs, from ANY of my machines


On the vista machine:

1. RUN CMD - I can issue RUN command from the VISTA machine with the IP addresses of any XP machines I can then see/browse that machine.
   
2. PING - I can ping out for VISTA to all machines
   
3. WINDOWS - I cannot see any XP machine from within Windows Explorer I see only the machine I'm on ( VISTA), and the router. I do not see the other machines, and I do nto see a link anywehre to the workgroup.

On the XP machines:

1. RUN CMD - I cannot access any machine , XP or the VISTA
   
2. PING - I can ping out to other XP machines, but not to the VISTA
   
3. WINDOWS - Under Entire Network, I see only the workgroup, but it errors/times out if I try to view workgroup machines.
   

Everything used to work fine… What could have happened that affected all the machines?? I can only thing of two thinks that are common;

1) One was a change in routers…after going back to the old one, same issue.
2) The other was that I installed Network Magic on most machines…I uninstalled them all…same issues

My brain is now mush. I am out of ideas. I am running Norton Security but this has never been an issue before ( and disabling it didnt address the issues)


Ref re Netbios". If you are using a static Internet Protocol (IP) address, click Enable NetBIOS over TCP/IP. If you have a DHCP-assigned IP address, click Use NetBIOS setting from the DHCP server. "

 

[Mediaman]

Some clues, based on earlier suggestions

VISTA reports that it is the master browser , per
- Services
- nbrstat

But clearly I am having a computer browsing issue, so I downloaded BROWSTAT and it said " Browsing is NOT active on domain. Master name cannot be determined from GetAdapterStatus."

So this got me thinking its back to Norton, somehow, is the service is running but it being blocked. So I turned off Personal Firewall (again) and reran BROWSTAT. Hmmmm, BINGO...now it reports " Master browser is running build 6000" but also that its "Unable to retrieve server list from PC01: 1130"

So:

1) how do I resolve the serveer list error or is it not significant?

2) does Personal Firewall not offer some protection?? okay to leave it permanently disabled? ie both Norton and Windos Firewall off??

3) per prior post re "the new subnet may not be in "trusted" status.", is there a way to keep the firewall on and simply have the subnet trusted?

The good news is the network is now coming back to life. Workgroup PCs are starting to pop up !

 

[Mediaman]

If you are running a 3rd party software firewall, the new subnet may not be in "trusted" status..

OK I found trust control area of Norton whwre I can truat the "physical address is Xx-xx-xx-xx-xx-xx."

Which of the following MAC addresses should I 'trust" ?
- the main routers mac address for WAN?
- the main router mac address for LAN?
- the AP router mac address for WAN?
- the AP router mac address for LAN?
- the IP address for each computer?

I want to enable the Computer Browse servixe and permit home network file/ printer saving, but want to protect against potential threats.

 

[jdabbs]

I recommend disabling all client firewalls until operation has been restored. By doing this you save yourself the worry of having to second guess your firewall config.

 

[Mediaman]

I recommend disabling all client firewalls until operation has been restored. By doing this you save yourself the worry of having to second guess your firewall config.

jdabbs - Thanks. I concluded tee same thing. I restored the firewall, and trusted ONLY the main router mac address for LAN. So far so good. Thanks again for raiseing the firewall point. In the end, this was the culprit.

tim - I think this explains your earlier comment re "I'm having a hard time believing that the router change caused the problem ". As the router address was a trusted site in the firewall, then changing out the router meant the new router was no longer trusted, hence the problem surfaced. So it was no fault of the router itself (to your point), but rather the need to update the truated address in the firewall settings with the new router address.

 

[jdabbs]

I restored the firewall, and trusted ONLY the main router mac address for LAN. So far so good.

Since NetBIOS updates come from the individual PCs in your network, you should whitelist the entire subnet.

 

[Mediaman]

Does your Vista Network Map discovery see all the PCs including the wireles router, and your 3 wireless access point on the grid?

I can access all machines in all directions, but wanted to return to the above question. When I select View full maps:

a) I do NOT see any wireless access points. The Vista machine itself has no wireless capability itself, but I do have two additioanl APs on the LAN. I was not expecting to see them. Does your map show them????

b) I DO see all wired computers and the main router, however all the connected machines ( all are XP) are listed on the bottom with the note "the following discovered devices cannot be placed in the map" .​

See attached.

Re (b), I read the notes on the screen, and I think it might be "The computer is running Windows XP and the LLTD protocol is not installed. Before a computer running Windows XP can be detected and placed correctly on the network map, you need to install the Link Layer Topology Discovery (LLTD) protocol on that computer. For more information about how to display computers running Windows XP on the network map, go to Network Map Does Not Display Computers Running Windows XP on the Microsoft website." I went to that link, but could not find the reference to XP !!

 

[tipstir]

Try this below...

I've posted this below on many forums, but you can try to see if you're done the following as this is how I have mine on my Vista SP1.


Did you change the discovery options in Vista or did you leave it to the default. vista has the discovery map viewer if you can't see your router listed in this viewer then you have a problem. I ran into the same thing you're going through now.

This is what I did...

click on each one listed below
1. Flag
2. Network
3. first network view every network pc should be listed along with the router if not let's continue on
4. network and sharing center
5. network should be private not public for one thing
6. vista has IPv6 and IPv4 XP just had IPv4 (this allows you to change the DHCP)
7. manage network connections (right panel)
8. properties
9 everything in their should be checked off, but if you're having issues you might want to uncheck
10. IPv6 and just use IPv4.

I use both and haven't seen any issues

The above you might have done, now do the following....

Now leave that popup open and go back to Network and Sharing Center

Under the section called Sharing and Discovery (it should look like this)

on
on
off
off
on
off

What does the full map view show?

Should be your computer name, the wireless router or wireless access point and the internet globe

Way below that are the list of PCs on the network.

Make sure your wireless encyption is set to either WEP64-128bit if you have WPA/WPA2 use those harder for anyone to break into the WPA/WPA2 than it is with WEP keys.


Other examples...

Change the performance speed to 54Mbps for the wireless nic. To do this under Vista you need to go back:

to network
managed network connection (left panel)
right click on your wireless network connection
click on properties
click on configure
click on advance
change Rate/speed whatever it's called to a Value: 54 (don't use best rate or etc)

If you don't see this last feature mentioned then, go to your laptop maker web site and get the latest driver for that model.
Note: You should see 5 bars all lit up green. If you're see less then your wireless connection signal is weak. To fix that you
need to add wireless access point nearby. Otherwise the 54mbps won't be available always you'll see less than that.


One more thing, don't let the wireless nic go into a sleep mode even if you're using battery. Because if you do it will cut out the connection and it might not comeback quick enough for the router to see the laptop. You might not have this issue I just notice that happens, but to fix that is to use a wireless access point bridge. Remember a solid connection better performance.

 

[Mediaman]

I found that WPA2 with G-only mode reduced the dbm signal and gone back to WPA AES for security.

Is the above a common recommendation? ie when using G-only, dont bother with WPA2 and just use WPA (and strong password of course)?

 

[tipstir]

Is the above a common recommendation? ie when using G-only, dont bother with WPA2 and just use WPA (and strong password of course)?

Yes you're correct..

 

[thiggins]

Tipstir,

Could you please provide a reference or two for this "common" recommendation? First I have heard of it...

 

[tipstir]

Well I was testing it on my own equipment and Wireless G gone from Very Good to Low when WPA2 AES was enabled. When I when back to WPA AES it gone back up to Very Good. I've changed things since then but now I am at solid Excellent so that would be me over the top of 20dB using Buffalo WLI-CB-G54HP.

Anyway For Draft-N I would have to use WPA2 AES to get the max throughput on Draft-N NIC adapters.

I know you use IX wireless testing what about Wireless Spectrum Analyzer you have use that software. IX and Qcheck won't install and when it does install I get a error.

 

[Mediaman]

I suppose some WPA vs WPA2 Netstumbler charts would make a clearer case....and perhaps it also depends on the router???

 

[tipstir]

I suppose some WPA vs WPA2 Netstumbler charts would make a clearer case....and perhaps it also depends on the router???

Are you getting 50db on WPA or WPA2 are you seeing higher using Net Stumbler? I just added more switches and installed APs in the area where the G wasn't stronger than 10-20dB, now it's over 20dB showing Excellent. But I've notice that all NiCs are not quite what they're suppose to be in dBm. One is right on top of the AP and darn card stills says Very Good. That one is from Belkin old one being replaced Draft-N 20dBm soon.

 

[jdabbs]

Well I was testing it on my own equipment and Wireless G gone from Very Good to Low when WPA2 AES was enabled. When I when back to WPA AES it gone back up to Very Good. I've changed things since then but now I am at solid Excellent so that would be me over the top of 20dB using Buffalo WLI-CB-G54HP.

My gut reaction is to be skeptical that a change that affects CPU utilization (increase load due to encryption/decryption) would also cause a reduction in signal intensity (radio).

Throughput, sure. Measurable signal loss? I'd say a flaw in testing methodology.

 

[thiggins]

I have to agree with jdabbs. In the end, it's the throughput that counts.

And yes, for most draft 11n adapters, no WPA2 AES is the only wireless security that won't cut your throughput in half. The exception are a few adapters that I have seen that use Ralink chipsets. But I also have seen Ralink-based products produce the usual 50%+ reduction when WPA/TKIP or WEP are used.

 

[tipstir]

I have to agree with jdabbs. In the end, it's the throughput that counts.

And yes, for most draft 11n adapters, no WPA2 AES is the only wireless security that won't cut your throughput in half. The exception are a few adapters that I have seen that use Ralink chipsets. But I also have seen Ralink-based products produce the usual 50%+ reduction when WPA/TKIP or WEP are used.

I'll test it again to... In the meantime..

Tim you have access to D-LINK forums https://forums.dlink.com section called 300Mbps connection requirements.



300 Mbps connection requirements! Please read!
« on: November 07, 2007, 09:25:23 AM »

To have your Draft N wireless network connect at 300Mbps as it should, ensure that the following requirements are met.

1) The router and adapter are both D-Link 802.11N products and are using the latest firmeware/drivers. Ensure that the 802.11 Mode of the router has a 802.11N mode selected. Also if you have issues with mixed mode, try locking the 802.11Mode to either 802.11N Only or 802.11G/N.

2) If you are using encryption the router must be configured to use AES cipher. In some firmware versions/models, the only way to get the AES cipher is to run WPA2. If you can not select the Cipher, selecting WPA2 only will force this cipher type.

3) The channel width needs to be set to 20/40Auto, if it is not, the adapter will report a connection speed of 130Mbps. This is a feature that was added for compatibility with Intel 802.11N adapters, as they only operate on a channel width of 20.

D-Link reccomends that you use the D-Link Wireless utility, however the Windows Zero Config will also work.

Assuming you have met all of these conditions, you should see a 300Mbps connection speed with either the D-Link Utility or WZC.

Note: Intel adapters are not the same as D-Links' N line. Intel Centrino adapters do not support the broader 40 Channel Width option. This (by design) limits their connection speed to 130.

 

[Bart]

b) I DO see all wired computers and the main router, however all the connected machines ( all are XP) are listed on the bottom with the note "the following discovered devices cannot be placed in the map" .[/INDENT]

You need Link Layer Topology Discovery for that. Download it here and install it. After that, your XP pc's will also be found on the network.